Fabio Capello thread

Senatore_M84 · Feb 9, 2012

Christian said:
He coached Juventus... If Inter offered him a good project I don't think he'd hesitate for a second. They won't be able to lure him with what they've got now obviously though.

He PLAYED at Juventus and Milan.. Actually 2.5 times as many games for Juve as Milan.

Inter have tried to get him before, he said no.

rest f your post was class.

BTW Conte built a system where it's near impossible to press him anyway. Basically built a team around pirlo, which coincidentally is undefeated. Hence why he's among best players in world. He makes everyone around him better. I'd take him over most anyone other than xavi if my interest was to build a TEAM

Sage · Feb 9, 2012

@ christian, you're silly

disrupting their flow would be essential, and everything passes through pirlo.

time and time again grand pa seedorf showed that he cannot play at AM, playing him as a ball player at LCM would have been a much better option, he couldn't even track down pirlo properly and stopped doing it after 20min.

there is no guarantee that Milan would have had a victory if he man marked pirlo, but its the most basic thing you can do when you face a team that has pirlo.

hleb and park ji sung destroying him come to mind.

Senatore_M84 · Feb 9, 2012

Sage said:
hleb and park ji sung destroying him come to mind.

Milan were MUCH more static teams reliant on pirlo to advance ball. Juve aren't such....

BTW, URby's finally found himself semi-useful at RCM.

Sage · Feb 9, 2012

Senatore_M84 said:
Milan were MUCH more static teams reliant on pirlo to advance ball. Juve aren't such....

BTW, URby's finally found himself semi-useful at RCM.

that's why people should stop claiming pirlo > our midfield and that Milan should have never let him go, if he was playing for Milan this season he would have been even worse than last season.

urby is def. playing better at CM, but his defensive qualities would be have been great for man marking pirlo at AM. Seedorf is crap at AM, playing him at LCM is what allegri should have done.

that's where you need to make tactical changes, sticking to 1 set up never helps anyone.

Senatore_M84 · Feb 9, 2012

Sage said:
that's why people should stop claiming pirlo > our midfield and that Milan should have never let him go, if he was playing for Milan this season he would have been even worse than last season.

urby is def. playing better at CM, but his defensive qualities would be have been great for man marking pirlo at AM. Seedorf is crap at AM, playing him at LCM is what allegri should have done.

that's where you need to make tactical changes, sticking to 1 set up never helps anyone.

i mean i agree with you to an extent, but we really do have to look at injury crisis before we say 'switch up formations'

he lacks ALOT of players, because galliani and berlusconi assembled a poor team of old players and injury prone ones. Should we be shocked PAto, Aquilani are out? That Seedorf Ambro and gattuso missed loads of time? Nesta is hurt? etc.

A tactical change, denotes, use of players with different characteristics. Does he have that?
--

i mean basically it's like cutting off your arm so the pain in your leg stops. He switches formations, we still got issues, just in a new area.

--

Christian · Feb 9, 2012

Senatore_M84 said:
He PLAYED at Juventus and Milan.. Actually 2.5 times as many games for Juve as Milan.

Inter have tried to get him before, he said no.

rest f your post was class.

BTW Conte built a system where it's near impossible to press him anyway. Basically built a team around pirlo, which coincidentally is undefeated. Hence why he's among best players in world. He makes everyone around him better. I'd take him over most anyone other than xavi if my interest was to build a TEAM

Yeah, but didn't he say that he'd never coach Juve when he was @ Roma, cause everyone hated Roma? I might be wrong, but I seem to remember there being a lot of anger towards him for that decision.

Sage said:
@ christian, you're silly

disrupting their flow would be essential, and everything passes through pirlo.

time and time again grand pa seedorf showed that he cannot play at AM, playing him as a ball player at LCM would have been a much better option, he couldn't even track down pirlo properly and stopped doing it after 20min.

there is no guarantee that Milan would have had a victory if he man marked pirlo, but its the most basic thing you can do when you face a team that has pirlo.

hleb and park ji sung destroying him come to mind.

You have a very simple way of seeing football imo. I might be wrong, but I'm not sure Pirlo even had that much control of the game, or that many passes. He was great ofcourse (As always

), but I don't think his influence was the deciding factor in this game. Both their goals came from direct attacks, not from long stretches of Pirlo controlling the game, which is what you'd be trying to stop with a guy on him... not sure why you're saying Emmanuelson shadowing him would've made such a difference.

Redman10 · Feb 9, 2012

I don't think you would be able to man mark him in Conte system. It the same reason you can't man mark Xavi. He doesn't dwell on ball as much like he did here b/c there is always movement from other players. You can try to apply pressure on him for 90 minutes make it difficult for him but you can't give him space and time like Allegri did for the 2nd straight time.

Sage · Feb 9, 2012

Christian said:
You have a very simple way of seeing football imo. I might be wrong, but I'm not sure Pirlo even had that much control of the game, or that many passes. He was great ofcourse (As always ), but I don't think his influence was the deciding factor in this game. Both their goals came from direct attacks, not from long stretches of Pirlo controlling the game, which is what you'd be trying to stop with a guy on him... not sure why you're saying Emmanuelson shadowing him would've made such a difference.

my view maybe simple, but at least I would get the freaking basics right, and I'm not the one being paid 2.5 million euros.

you're just finding anyway to defend allegri, saying that it wouldn't have made a difference is very shallow, disrupting a team's rhythm is the best thing to do when they rely on a player like pirlo to link up plays.

just look at juve when teams press pirlo, they rely on bullshit long balls and end up with a draw.

anyways this match is done, and allegri yet again proves how much of a simpleton he is.

Senatore_M84 · Feb 9, 2012

Redman10 said:
I don't think you would be able to man mark him in Conte system. It the same reason you can't man mark Xavi. He doesn't dwell on ball as much like he did here b/c there is always movement from other players. You can try to apply pressure on him for 90 minutes make it difficult for him but you can't give him space and time like Allegri did for the 2nd straight time.

Bingo.

when the team is always moving, pirlo's good enough to not sit on it and pass it.

worst part of late ancelotti/leo years was how formuliac we were.

Defender to pirlo. Gattuso and Ambrosini sitting side by side, not moving, AM waiting. Obviously easy to man mark that.

Madridista · Feb 9, 2012

Senatore_M84 said:
Capello benched Del Piero for Zlatan when Del Piero was in his prime and Zlatan was not. Despite zlatan having a poor 05-06 he never benched him...

He should do that with Zlatan/Pato now, seeing it worked then.

Capello is tactically much more apt than Allegri. Agreed with everything sage, redman and spartan said :thumbsup:

Sage · Feb 9, 2012

Senatore_M84 said:
i mean i agree with you to an extent, but we really do have to look at injury crisis before we say 'switch up formations'

he lacks ALOT of players, because galliani and berlusconi assembled a poor team of old players and injury prone ones. Should we be shocked PAto, Aquilani are out? That Seedorf Ambro and gattuso missed loads of time? Nesta is hurt? etc.

A tactical change, denotes, use of players with different characteristics. Does he have that?
--

i mean basically it's like cutting off your arm so the pain in your leg stops. He switches formations, we still got issues, just in a new area.

--

we both know he can EASILY play a 3-4-1-2 which seems to be a trend in serie A these days.

he doesn't have the players to play with wingers, but he has abate/urby/mesbah/antonini who can pull off a good job at wing back, esp since they'll have less to worry about concerning the defence.

the 3 men at the back would be quality, and he has bonera to rotate.

I'm not even asking for the 3-4-1-2 to become the main formation, but for fucks sake it wont kill him to have it as a plan B.

lazio/udinese/juve all have different formations ready, allegri doesn't have a lot of options but he def. he has enough for a plan B.

conte has been lucky with injuries and playing teams when they're weak, but tactically he's miles ahead of allegri.

Christian · Feb 9, 2012

Sage said:
my view maybe simple, but at least I would get the freaking basics right, and I'm not the one being paid 2.5 million euros.

you're just finding anyway to defend allegri, saying that it wouldn't have made a difference is very shallow, disrupting a team's rhythm is the best thing to do when they rely on a player like pirlo to link up plays.

just look at juve when teams press pirlo, they rely on bullshit long balls and end up with a draw.

anyways this match is done, and allegri yet again proves how much of a simpleton he is.

I'm not trying to find a reason to defend Allegri, there's obviously something wrong since we lost. But I'm also not stupid enough to come up with an extremely vague statement, based on nothing, and use it to claim superiority to the guy who's payed 2.5 million euros just to sit and come up with tactics. You're gonna have to come up with something better than "disrupting their flow would be essential, and everything passes through pirlo". I mean, no shit? Disrupting every teams flow is usually a pretty good thing... I'm not saying it's necessarily wrong that we could've delt with Pirlo differently, I'm just saying that I find these kind of vague statements a ridiculess way to prove your point (You point beeing that Allegri is a noob ofc.).

Sage · Feb 9, 2012

Christian said:
I'm not trying to find a reason to defend Allegri, there's obviously something wrong since we lost. But I'm also not stupid enough to come up with an extremely vague statement, based on nothing, and use it to claim superiority to the guy who's payed 2.5 million euros just to sit and come up with tactics. You're gonna have to come up with something better than "disrupting their flow would be essential, and everything passes through pirlo". I mean, no shit? Disrupting every teams flow is usually a pretty good thing... I'm not saying it's necessarily wrong that we could've delt with Pirlo differently, I'm just saying that I find these kind of vague statements a ridiculess way to prove your point (You point beeing that Allegri is a noob ofc.).

you say "no shit" yet allegri didn't even try it, not in this game nor in the league game :lol:

I'm not saying I'm superior to allegri, but a pro whos overpaid should know the basics don't you think? or is he too arrogant to appoint someone to mark pirlo?

like I said, marking pirlo wouldn't guarantee a win (maybe I should post it in danish so you could understand?

) but its the LEAST he could have done.

Senatore_M84 · Feb 9, 2012

Sage said:
conte has been lucky with injuries and playing teams when they're weak, but tactically he's miles ahead of allegri.

I'm not sure that's true. I think he just has more quality options.

We got a better top players, but full 11 vs. full 11 he's got a better.

CF- MAtri /Quag v. Zlatan, Pato. Milan cause of Zlatan

SS/AMs- Robinho/Boateng v. Pepe/Vucinic/Estergarribia/KRasic

I'd say we're better BUT he has more options

CMs- no need to go in, they shit on us.

FB- litchsteiner/Cheillini > Abate/Mesbah

CB- Milan by a large margin

The difference in squads aint that much. If I made a combine milan/jube team it'd look like this-

Zlatan--Matri
Boateng
Vidal-Pirlo--Marchisio
Cheillini--Thiago--Nesta--Litchsteiner
Buffon

and sadly, their would be more juventino's on the bench.

I mean really.... beyond our top dogs, are we really better?

--

Eitherway, the no injuries is the MAIN point. We'd be first if boateng/aquilani/Robinho played as many games as marchisio, vidal, pirlo. Unfortunately, all the milan players have missed near 10 matches each.

Sage · Feb 9, 2012

you skipped the whole part of the post of allegri not having a plan B even though he has the players for it and went for the last bit :lol:

Christian · Feb 9, 2012

Sage said:
you say "no shit" yet allegri didn't even try it, not in this game nor in the league game

I'm not saying I'm superior to allegri, but a pro whos overpaid should know the basics don't you think? or is he too arrogant to appoint someone to mark pirlo?

like I said, marking pirlo wouldn't guarantee a win (maybe I should post it in danish so you could understand? ) but its the LEAST he could have done.

You're acting like Allegri just ignored Pirlo, which clearly wasn't the case. We both agreed that Seedorf marked him before the formation changes no? And even when Seedorf was getting tired, it's not like he was ignored and not attendend.

And it'd be great if you'd post in Danish, would really make my life easier. Thanks in advance

Edit: Also, I don't agree with you senatore. I think Al has much better players available, in particular in this game the quality of the players Al had was better imo. Guys like Estigarribia, Giancherrini, Padoin, Borrigol (Sorry Borriello) aren't very good individually imo. And I've never thought much of Cacares and Bonucci either, and Del Piero is older than Seedorf... Individually I don't think any Juve players except for Pirlo has much to offer, but they're really a great team, can't deny them that... think the praise Conte has received is justified. Don't think their squad belongs, even in the top 3, but he's really created a great group. Will be interesting to see what he can do next season when they'll be able to get top class players (Can he handle them?)...

Senatore_M84 · Feb 9, 2012

Sage said:
you skipped the whole part of the post of allegri not having a plan B even though he has the players for it and went for the last bit

i touched on it in my previous post. He does have plan b- he's gone to 3 forward xmas tree time and time again.

He uses different tactics.

Honestly, it's just hard to do shit with players he's got. How many different tactics can you do with ambrosin, urbyi? It's hard to find one which works, lol. My honesto pinioon...

Sage · Feb 9, 2012

@ christian

seedorf didn't even MARK pirlo, he didn't do jack shit, all he did was run after him for 15-20min and then completely ignored him.

and the dumbest thing you can do is put a 36 year old who just played 3 days ago to mark out pirlo :lol:

Redman10 · Feb 9, 2012

Senatore_M84 said:
i touched on it in my previous post. He does have plan b- he's gone to 3 forward xmas tree time and time again.

He uses different tactics.

Honestly, it's just hard to do shit with players he's got. How many different tactics can you do with ambrosin, urbyi? It's hard to find one which works, lol. My honesto pinioon...

You could try the 3-5-2 sage mention. I think you even mention you wouldn't mind seeing Silva in a sweeper type role. I think given the injury crisis it would of been the prefect time to at least try it.

Sage · Feb 9, 2012

Redman10 said:
You could try the 3-5-2 sage mention. I think you even mention you wouldn't mind seeing Silva in a sweeper type role. I think given the injury crisis it would of been the prefect time to at least try it.

he can easily use the 3-4-1-2 even with the current injury problems

GK

mexes nesta silva

abate/antonini MVB Seedorf/Nocerino Urby/Mesbah

Robinho/stephan

Maxi/Inzaghi/Robinho Ibra

at least he'll be able to rotate mids, and make use of the wing backs he has.

Christian · Feb 9, 2012

Sage said:
@ christian

seedorf didn't even MARK pirlo, he didn't do jack shit, all he did was run after him for 15-20min and then completely ignored him.

and the dumbest thing you can do is put a 36 year old who just played 3 days ago to mark out pirlo

But what you're suggesting is Urby @ AM, and Seedorf @ LCM right? So you'd rather have Seedorf being up against Cacares (The guy who scored twice) instead of the highly mobile Pirlo, and ofcourse Ambrosini (Who'd be RCM then) against and Gianccherini and Ext'arribia? Why is this such a logical way to organise the team? Please reply in Danish btw

Sage · Feb 9, 2012

Christian said:
But what you're suggesting is Urby @ AM, and Seedorf @ LCM right? So you'd rather have Seedorf being up against Cacares (The guy who scored twice) instead of the highly mobile Pirlo, and ofcourse Ambrosini (Who'd be RCM then) against and Gianccherini and Ext'arribia? Why is this such a logical way to organise the team? Please reply in Danish btw

seedorf is horrible at AM, we only know that apart from idiotic seedorf fan boys.

Ambro is better defensively than urby, so him at RCM and seedorf at LCM being the ball player would be the best choice for Milan.

seedorf's good performances under allegri have all come from LCM.

urby at RCM didn't make a difference defensively, they were still passing through quite easily :fp:

ww · Feb 9, 2012

Calum1903 said:
Milan should only take Capello back if he brings Emerson with him.

And Panucci.

MilanMB · Feb 9, 2012

Senatore_M84 said:
We don't need capello, we need players the caliber capello had.

Allegri's a world class coach in making, but he can't turn nocerino, aquilani, boateng, robinho into donadoni, savicevic, boban ,albertini

Stop repeating this.

People are idiots, doesn't matter how many times you say it, they will not understand.

For the heck of it, I'll just say it again:

Hey, guys, Allegri can't turn average players into WC players. Got it? No, I guess not. Carry on...

Sage · Feb 9, 2012

conte seems to be a genius at turning average players into good ones.

pepe/estigbababa/giacharini/barzagli/bonucci

MilanMB · Feb 9, 2012

Conte's team is only 1 (maybe 4) points ahead of us in the league and doesn't have the CL to think about, which is a MAJOR advantage. He doesn't have a major injury crisis to think about either.

ffs, simple things like this should be easy to figure out for yourself.

Sage · Feb 9, 2012

^^

I've been saying that all season.

but it doesn't change the fact that the average players in his squad are having good seasons.

Redman10 · Feb 9, 2012

You could also say Conte covers the limitations of his players. Juve has average players as well. I would say Milan has more quality overall then them but they have own Milan twice.

MilanMB · Feb 9, 2012

Only Barzagli has had a good season, a really good one at that.

The rest of them hasn't a better season than l-son, Nocerino etc. Nothing special.

And still, the biggest reason why they're a whopping one point in front of us is because of the injuries we've had. Shouldn't that be taken into consideration?

I don't take people blaming Allegri for this and that seriously, just shows a lack of general knowledge. Allegri is a very good coach, not a world beater yet, but a very good coach.

I just look at the midfield he has, with or without an injury crisis, and I'm blown away.

ww · Feb 9, 2012

MilanMB said:
Stop repeating this.

People are idiots, doesn't matter how many times you say it, they will not understand.

For the heck of it, I'll just say it again:

Hey, guys, Allegri can't turn average players into WC players. Got it? No, I guess not. Carry on...

It's not that I find Allegri a bad coach, he's very good and not a problem for Milan.

It's just that if Milan has the chance to get Capello or Mourinho, I won't say "no".

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