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View Poll Results: Who should be the new Milan captain
Alessio Romagnoli 17 89.47%
Giacomo Bonaventura 1 5.26%
Cristian Zapata 0 0%
Gonzalo Higuain 1 5.26%
Lucas Biglia 0 0%
Voters: 19. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 19-12-2011, 18:06   #101
Senatore_M84
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Originally Posted by necromancer View Post
Yes. Ultimately the question is whether we'd sacrifice a late runner who's scoring regularly (Nocerino) for more defensive work (Gattuso). That's an interesting choice that Allegri will have to make in the latter part of the season.

It should depend on the opposition - the way football is being played in Europe at present, I wont be surprised if he picks Noce for CL and Gattuso (maybe) for Serie A matches. That's probably how I'd pick.
Funny, i almost think he'd go opposite (Noce for serie A, Rino for UCL)

I think i'd go for...

Boateng
Nocerino---Rino
Seedorf

in ucl. However that's 100% dependent on Rino's return to form.

Atleast i think i like that v. arsenal considering they tend to attack wide.

I fear we'll see the nocerino, mvb, rino CM, which will be a true eyesore for the viewer.


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Only Milan can punish it's own fans by qualifying for CL. I'm off to sleep, another year wasted. When will this fucker be fired..
#RnB
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Old 19-12-2011, 18:09   #102
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Originally Posted by Senatore_M84 View Post
Funny, i almost think he'd go opposite (Noce for serie A, Rino for UCL)

I think i'd go for...

Boateng
Nocerino---Rino
Seedorf

in ucl. However that's 100% dependent on Rino's return to form.

Atleast i think i like that v. arsenal considering they tend to attack wide.

I fear we'll see the nocerino, mvb, rino CM, which will be a true eyesore for the viewer.
Europe is way more open at present. We really dont need Gattuso there. Reasonably sure that several knockout games will turn out to be goalfests as well.

Aquilani-MvB-Nocerino for CL and I dont mind Gattuso swapping in for Nocerino for Serie A.
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Old 19-12-2011, 18:10   #103
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Europe is way more open at present. We really dont need Gattuso there. Reasonably sure that several knockout games will turn out to be goalfests as well.

Aquilani-MvB-Nocerino for CL and I dont mind Gattuso swapping in for Nocerino for Serie A.
The question is, do we want to play open v. a team like arsenal who is more athletic?

I think an open game is how we'd get into trouble v. them


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Only Milan can punish it's own fans by qualifying for CL. I'm off to sleep, another year wasted. When will this fucker be fired..
#RnB
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Old 19-12-2011, 18:13   #104
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The question is, do we want to play open v. a team like arsenal who is more athletic?

I think an open game is how we'd get into trouble v. them
Both ties to have different strategies. It is crucial to score goals at home. Last 3 times, we've got off to slow starts at home. The pressure tells then, when you go to London for the away leg.

I'd play the more attacking formation and get a couple of goals in the first half before Arsenal adjusts to the San Siro.

Possibly we could be more defensive when we visit the Emirates with a solid lead. Having a solid lead in the first leg is very, very important.
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Old 19-12-2011, 18:27   #105
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The defense improved after Aquilani and Nocerino changed sides and Aquilani played deeper, more as a regista, more careful with his forward runs to the box.

Aquilani won 37 tackles btw, it's 2.6 per game, van Bommel 25 (2.3 per game). Nocerino 24 (1.8).
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Old 19-12-2011, 18:31   #106
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Both ties to have different strategies. It is crucial to score goals at home. Last 3 times, we've got off to slow starts at home. The pressure tells then, when you go to London for the away leg.

I'd play the more attacking formation and get a couple of goals in the first half before Arsenal adjusts to the San Siro.

Possibly we could be more defensive when we visit the Emirates with a solid lead. Having a solid lead in the first leg is very, very important.
But if you attack at home in the first leg you risk conceding and it's hard to come back from that. Balance is key. I'd take a 0-0 at home than a 2-1 win.

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The defense improved after Aquilani and Nocerino changed sides and Aquilani played deeper, more as a regista, more careful with his forward runs to the box.

Aquilani won 37 tackles btw, it's 2.6 per game, van Bommel 25 (2.3 per game). Nocerino 24 (1.8).


Aquilani's defensive contribution is vastly underrated because of the midget divers and Lazio games. Plus some ignorant idiots think he's weak because he's thin but he's actually a fighter with a nice level of balls.
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Old 19-12-2011, 18:34   #107
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Yes, Aquilani and Nocerino changing sides has been critical. I quite like Aqua-MvB-Noce combo in our midfield. Should definitely be the starting CL combination, no questions in my mind.

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But if you attack at home in the first leg you risk conceding and it's hard to come back from that. Balance is key. I'd take a 0-0 at home than a 2-1 win.
I would have with our 03-07 team. Not now. They aren't mentally strong enough to go with a 0-0 to the Emirates. Big win at home = we'll win the tie. Milan need to be fearsome at the San Siro once more. I can't stress on that enough. We really can't bank on getting by and trying for away goals to rescue us. A large part of our CL shortcomings currently is mental.

Last edited by necromancer; 19-12-2011 at 18:39.
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Old 19-12-2011, 18:45   #108
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I would have with our 03-07 team. Not now. They aren't mentally strong enough to go with a 0-0 to the Emirates. Big win at home = we'll win the tie. Milan need to be fearsome at the San Siro once more. I can't stress on that enough. We really can't bank on getting by and trying for away goals to rescue us. A large part of our CL shortcomings currently is mental.
It's all up to Pato and Boateng IMO. The team creates a lot but there's no one that goes for goal. Even Boateng is lately always looking for a pass rather than having a go.

You are making sense but conceding at home is too dangerous. It's what fucked the team vs Tottenham when Allegri risked too much. I'd love a win but it should be gained by firstly limiting their attacking threat, like vs United in 07. First Ancelotti made sure Rooney, Ronaldo, and Giggs were kept at bay and then Kaka, Clarence, and co. finished the job.

I'd definitely play Rino if fit. Currently I'm thinking some sort of 4-1-3-1-1 (my thoughts could change leading up to the game).

Van Bommel
Rino - Aquilani/Seedorf - Nocerino

Boateng
Ibra/Pato
(depending on form)

I'd even look into playing Rino on the left to help out Zambrotta and Nocerino on the right. Limit Walcott and Gervinho, Aquilani or Seedorf to orchestrate and Boateng and Ibra/Pato to finish the job.

Purely tactically speaking, I'm leaning more towards Pato because he makes the necessary runs and could be deadly with Boateng. Perfect scenario would be playing all three but Pato and Ibra haven't really found the chemistry yet and I'm not sure we could afford playing the 3 center midfield system. It could get run over or out-possession-ed. 4 man is more safe but as I said it's all up to Boateng and Pato.
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Old 19-12-2011, 18:53   #109
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The difference with 07 is that we play at home first. Can't depend on scoring the goals in the away leg. It'll be the Spurs story all over. Allegri was too cautious last year in the home leg.

Dropping Ibra is akin to dropping Kaka in 2007. I just do not understand that line of thought.

Anyway, we must stick to our very capable 4-3-1-2/4-3-3 hybrid in my view. Boateng behind Ibra and Pato. Based on form/injury, wouldnt mind Robinho ahead of Pato either.
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Old 29-12-2011, 22:14   #110
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1st LEG in SAN SIRO:

------ROBINHO-----------IBRA-------------
----------------PRINCE-----------------
----NOCERINO----------AQUILANI----
--------------VAN BOMMEL------------
-----------------------------------------
ZAMBROTTA--------------------ABATE
----------T.SILVA-----NESTA---------
-----------------------------------------
-----------------ABBIATI---------------

SUB: PATO if Goal Needed *

2nd Leg in EMIRATES:

--------------------PATO----------------
--------ROBINHO----------------------------
----------------PRINCE-----------------
----NOCERINO----------GATTUSO----
--------------VAN BOMMEL------------
-----------------------------------------
NINI/ZAMBRO------------------ABATE
----------T.SILVA-----NESTA---------
-----------------------------------------
-----------------ABBIATI---------------

SUB: IBRA if Pato/Binho ineffective


I would play our best players in home and most attacking. Robinho-Ibra partnership has done well and I would keep that. In the 2nd half I would bring in Pato and unleash him to make tons of runs behind the tired Arsenal defense for the last 30 minutes of the game.

For the away fixture, I would play a more physical midfield, with a counter-attacking brazilian attack. No need to play Ibra, just allow Robinho-Pato to counter attack for us as I believe they do well together. IF we need a goal of course, bring in Ibra at half time. Play Antonini in 2nd fixture if Zambrotta is not fit or in form. Taiwo should probably not be risked either game as his lack of pace /coordination could allow the fast Arsenal wingers to expose him.
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Old 30-12-2011, 03:41   #111
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Originally Posted by ELMAGO99 View Post
1st LEG in SAN SIRO:

------ROBINHO-----------IBRA-------------
----------------PRINCE-----------------
----NOCERINO----------AQUILANI----
--------------VAN BOMMEL------------
-----------------------------------------
ZAMBROTTA--------------------ABATE
----------T.SILVA-----NESTA---------
-----------------------------------------
-----------------ABBIATI---------------

SUB: PATO if Goal Needed *

2nd Leg in EMIRATES:

--------------------PATO----------------
--------ROBINHO----------------------------
----------------PRINCE-----------------
----NOCERINO----------GATTUSO----
--------------VAN BOMMEL------------
-----------------------------------------
NINI/ZAMBRO------------------ABATE
----------T.SILVA-----NESTA---------
-----------------------------------------
-----------------ABBIATI---------------

SUB: IBRA if Pato/Binho ineffective


For the away fixture, I would play a more physical midfield, with a counter-attacking brazilian attack. That midfield has not a single player who is comfortable on the ball and so without a targetman like Ibra to play long balls to to hold up the play, the ball will just keep coming back and we would have to defend for the hole game.

No need to play Ibra, just allow Robinho-Pato to counter attack for us as I believe they do well together. But Ibra will play for sure though.

Play Antonini in 2nd fixture if Zambrotta is not fit or in form. Taiwo should probably not be risked either game as his lack of pace /coordination could allow the fast Arsenal wingers to expose him. Agreed. Taiwo is garbage.
I don't think its necessary to clog the midfield with ball winners against Arsenal. Their dribbling threat comes from wide as their central midfield are very reserved possession style players who rarely drive forward with the ball by dribbling or making late off the ball runs. With that in mind, I don't think MVB is necessary against them and we can sacrifice him for Seedorf.

I like Fiero's idea of Gattuso on the left of the midfield three to help out whoever is playing leftback, as that is clearly our weakest spot. I would play Anto over Zambro as Walcott's threat is pure pace and not dribbling or cutting inside. Similar to the way we played Lennon in the second leg against Tottenham in London with Janku and Boateng.

Playing Seedorf will give the freedom to Aqua to play higher and join Boateng higher up and making Ibra less likely to have to drop deep. When Ibra drops too deep his habit of loosing the ball alot will be more dangerous for us to concede counter attacks.

Boateng of course playing in the hole and Robinho buzzing around in the wider channels attempting to keep their fullbacks guessing about whether to attack or not.
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Old 21-01-2012, 23:50   #112
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An interesting thought from the derby. Not really original and might be old news, but the lack of brains in Milan's midfield is appalling. With Aquilani out, the team is essentially a bunch of runners. Nocerino is a runner, so is Urby, Robinho, Boateng, and Abate. Silva, Nesta, and Van Bommel are the only ones left who are intelligent enough to do something useful with the ball. In other words, the three main defenders are the team's best playmakers. And no Ibra isn't a playmaker as much as he is a creator forward, in a sense that he's not the one to set the tempo or organize the play (and that's not criticism, it's not and shouldn't be his role).

The thing is, with the current set of players and with Aquilani out, I'm thinking Van Bommel is the best playmaker this team has. Hear me out, he's not flashy but he's intelligent, a great reader of the game, and a comfortable passer. He knows how to spread the play, when to raise the tempo, and can pass with both feet even under pressure. The key is not to surround him with just a bunch of dumb runners, but rather at least 1 or at best 2 players that could win the ball back, thus easing the defensive burden of him and allowing him to move a little bit forward and assume control of the game.

Nocerino's not a ball winner, neither is Urby. Rino is unfit and so the best option is (don't shoot me!) Ambrosini. He's been in lethargic form this season but that's mainly due to not being able to run as much as required from a wide center midfielder.

With Boateng already out and Urby adding nothing constructive to the attack, I'd consider a formation change, kind of like this:

Ambrosini

Van Bommel - Nocerino


Shaarawy - Robinho

Ibra

I really trust Van Bommel as the most complete midfielder and the one most likely to control the game out of the current available players. Ambrosini has done really well as an anchor last season, and with Van Bommel's help defensively and Nocerino's running the midfield won't be lightweight. As for the offense, creativity could come from Ibra as well as Van Bommel's intelligent distribution to the whole bunch of runners (Noce, Shaarawy, Robinho).
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Old 22-01-2012, 01:21   #113
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Van Bommel

Ambrosini - Nocerino


Shaarawy - Robinho

Ibra

I'd prefer more mobile player to accompany Noce, Ambrosini's speed slightly better than Bommel's.


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Old 22-01-2012, 01:27   #114
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I wouldnt play Ambro and MVB in the same lineup, we all saw what happened vs Leece
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Old 22-01-2012, 01:55   #115
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I honestly would never player a 3 DM lineup. It really asking for trouble as all 3 are not creative enough and only 1 is comfortable in possession.
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Old 22-01-2012, 12:56   #116
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I wouldnt play Ambro and MVB in the same lineup, we all saw what happened vs Leece
Yes but Ambro was the one playing further forward and asked to do all the running. I still believe he can do a good job as the anchor. While Van Bommel is better on the ball than Ambro and has better distribution, thus is the most suitable IMO out of the available players to be the playmaker in midfield.

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I honestly would never player a 3 DM lineup. It really asking for trouble as all 3 are not creative enough and only 1 is comfortable in possession.
But is Nocerino really a DM? I mean he contributes more to the attack than the defense. And there's no ball players available anyway so I rather see some intelligent players who could defend rather than just idiotic runners.
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Old 22-01-2012, 15:34   #117
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Allegri practically did exactly as I said in the 2nd half. Except that he trusted Ambrosini to be the playmaker in midfield, and he handled the responsibility really well. End result: 2-0.
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Old 22-01-2012, 16:16   #118
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Allegri practically did exactly as I said in the 2nd half. Except that he trusted Ambrosini to be the playmaker in midfield, and he handled the responsibility really well. End result: 2-0.
Actually he did exactly as I said.
Your Bommel play as RCM


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Old 07-02-2012, 03:07   #119
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How Maxi and Muntari will fit in:

Great read.
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Old 10-02-2012, 14:46   #120
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http://www.whoscored.com/Blog/sanfjx...guytstca/Show/

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Milan might not have been the best football team during the middle of the last decade, but they were probably the most sophisticated. Think back to the successful sides of 2004-06 – Greece, Porto, Liverpool (and at a stretch, Italy). They were all great stories, but extremely functional, largely defensive sides. Even the Barcelona side that won the Champions League in 2006 had Mark van Bommel and Edmilson as part of its midfield trio, which hardly represents tiki-taka.

Central midfield zones then were about power, force and physicality, but Milan were different. They went completely the other way – they had Andrea Pirlo at the base of midfield, and Kaka at the top. Clarence Seedorf fitted on the side of the diamond, and sometimes they brought in Rui Costa to play a Christmas Tree, and managed to fit four playmakers in the same side. Granted, they had Rino Gattuso sweeping up behind, but it was still a magnificently technical side.

Pep Guardiola, who complained his career as a deep-lying playmaker ended prematurely because of the focus on physique rather than technique, pinpointed Milan as the only ideologues of that period. “They play a completely different brand of football,” he said. “But they’re not trendsetters, they’re the exception.”

They still are. But whereas Guardiola has gone onto make technical football THE way to play football, Milan have bucked the trend again. Pirlo has departed, with Mark van Bommel in his place, but Pirlo remains the most gifted, and the most prolific, passer in the league. He completes 81.2 passes per game at Juventus, a figure the Milan midfield can only dream of. Their top passer is actually a centre-back, Thiago Silva, with 64.1. Granted, van Bommel is not far behind on 62.5, but the style of passing is completely different to Pirlo. Whereas Pirlo plays 2.7 key passes per game, van Bommel’s figure is just 0.2. That’s not the Dutchman’s fault – he’s a different player and asked to play a different role, but it reflects what Max Allegri wants from his team. The artistry of Pirlo was deemed surplus to requirements.


The situation in that position is a microcosm of how Milan have changed; their midfield is now based around physical attributes. Antonio Nocerino has been a success, but his game is basically about running a lot. At Ajax, Urby Emanuelson was one of those weird players that didn’t really have a set position, but had good stamina and was left-footed, so could play anywhere up and down the left touchline. It seemed a sensible signing – Milan needed width, but he’s often been deployed at the top of the diamond, when he simply doesn’t have the qualities to be a trequartista.

Kevin-Prince Boateng is another fielded in that role, and another odd case. He has certainly performed well at Milan, but mainly because he’s so energetic. With a defensive-minded midfield and often a static front two, Milan need a shuttler in that position to prevent the side becoming ‘broken’, to prevent the gap between midfield and attack becoming too large. Boateng fits the bill brilliantly, but again, he’s not remotely creative. He averages just 1.3 key passes per game, a figure that puts him lower than Chievo’s Michael Bradley – the definition of a box-to-box midfielder, who relies on his energy, not his skill.

Milan’s leader in terms of ‘key passes’ is Zlatan Ibrahimovic on 2.9, then Robinho on 1.7. They depend highly upon individual quality upfront rather than intelligent play from midfield for chance creation. Amazingly, the player with most assists – seven – is Antonio Cassano, who hasn’t played since October, demonstrating their creative weaknesses.

Just behind Cassano on that count is Alberto Aquilani, clearly a much more intelligent, thoughtful player than many of the other Milan options in midfield. His average rating of 7.57 is considerably higher than any other Milan player in one of the two ‘outside’ points of the diamond, but he hasn’t yet appeared in 2012 through injury – and besides, he’s only on loan. Reports this week that Milan have agreed a deal with Fiorentina captain Riccardo Montolivo, out of contract in the summer, certainly makes sense. He is a proper regista – only Pirlo and Daniele De Rossi complete more passes per game than him in Serie A.

Statistically, the major factor Milan lead the way in is their aerial duel success rate, 58%. In that respect, they are the Italian equivalent of Stoke. Well, not really – they are in the top three in pass completion rate and average percentage of possession. But it demonstrates what they’re good at, and is representative of their incredible U-turn in recent years.

They are essentially now the opposite of Barcelona. Guardiola’s side is clearly a better team than Real Madrid in head-to-head matches, but look likely to lose the league based upon inferior performances against the other 18. Milan don’t have the intelligence to break down good sides, but they can easily blast past minnows. Against top clubs, Milan struggle; they haven’t beaten any of the top six in Serie A this season.

So whereas Milan’s style in the mid-2000s was good for Europe (one league title but three European Cup finals), now they’re well in the title running, but very much outsiders in the Champions League.
Interesting to see if Milan are ahead of the trend or behind it in terms of the strong runner midfield.


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