Brazilian Football Thread

Australiano1980 · Jul 26, 2010

Mano was really excited about the football played for spain in WC... so i expect brazil playing more like them.. he tried to do this with corinthians too, but corinthians midfield players arent able to build nothing on front like mano wanted.

i hope see in brazil with..

.................victor

jonathas-chicão-miranda-wesley?

...............hernanes

......elias.................giuliano

................ganso

......robinho........kleber

even bruno cesar has a chance i think.

Senatore_M84 · Jul 26, 2010

ah didn't realize you were talking next world cup... thought u meant for now and copa america next year....

for 2014 world cup i'd assume something like....

Dunno
alves---silva---miranda---marcelo
Sandro
Ramires----hernanes
ganso
pato---robinho

I realize marcelo one will get laughs. He needs to leave madrid. go to a real TEAM and realize his potential. Going forward he's awesome, just needs a good coach and patience. Only 22.

Robinho is similar situation to marcelo. So many players don't realize whats good for them. It's not madrid. Madrid is toxic and has been since perez took his first reign. Until they re-shape there way and build teams (not assemblies of stars) the won't win

Another option is Carlos Eduardo somewhere.... hard to leave him off but i didn't know who to put him over. Hernanes might be most fundamental player as he's only true ball playing CM (unless Ganso moves farther back which is a wastE)

Sven · Jul 26, 2010

Australiano1980 said:
Mano was really excited about the football played for spain in WC... so i expect brazil playing more like them.. he tried to do this with corinthians too, but corinthians midfield players arent able to build nothing on front like mano wanted.

Interesting, Mano loves the Spain's 4-2-3-1 since his Grêmio days. He was using it at Corinthians too. Maybe he will try in Seleção?

ww · Jul 26, 2010

Senatore_M84 said:
ah didn't realize you were talking next world cup... thought u meant for now and copa america next year....

for 2014 world cup i'd assume something like....

Dunno
alves---silva---miranda---marcelo
Sandro
Ramires----hernanes
ganso
pato---robinho

I realize marcelo one will get laughs. He needs to leave madrid. go to a real TEAM and realize his potential. Going forward he's awesome, just needs a good coach and patience. Only 22.

Robinho is similar situation to marcelo. So many players don't realize whats good for them. It's not madrid. Madrid is toxic and has been since perez took his first reign. Until they re-shape there way and build teams (not assemblies of stars) the won't win

Another option is Carlos Eduardo somewhere.... hard to leave him off but i didn't know who to put him over. Hernanes might be most fundamental player as he's only true ball playing CM (unless Ganso moves farther back which is a wastE)

I wouldn't laugh about Marcelo. He's great at attacking although a disaster at defending. I would go with Naldo on the left because I like the catenaccio.

Now Robinho is just awful. He hardly do something against organized defenses. He played 2 good games against São Paulo in his whole career and that was when we had a stupid ofensive coach and awful defenders. Then São Paulo fired this asshole and brough Josué, Mineiro, Lugano and better players to the defense and Robinho never played well again, even getting more matured.

Another big boy that Robinho played good games is Argentina, that I can't even remember the last time that they had a good defense. Robinho also played well against Italy and that was like a rehearsal to their WC. Getting raped by Robinho is the first step to get raped by Slovakia.

Players that can't be out of this new Brazil at all: Breno, Carlos Eduardo and Wesley.

And I hope that Mano only likes Spain's formation. I don't wanna see that shit in Brazil.

And by the way I already saw Mourinho using this formation and doing way better.

Australiano1980 · Jul 26, 2010

Senatore_M84 said:
ah didn't realize you were talking next world cup... thought u meant for now and copa america next year....

for 2014 world cup i'd assume something like....

Dunno
alves---silva---miranda---marcelo
Sandro
Ramires----hernanes
ganso
pato---robinho

I realize marcelo one will get laughs. He needs to leave madrid. go to a real TEAM and realize his potential. Going forward he's awesome, just needs a good coach and patience. Only 22.

Robinho is similar situation to marcelo. So many players don't realize whats good for them. It's not madrid. Madrid is toxic and has been since perez took his first reign. Until they re-shape there way and build teams (not assemblies of stars) the won't win

Another option is Carlos Eduardo somewhere.... hard to leave him off but i didn't know who to put him over. Hernanes might be most fundamental player as he's only true ball playing CM (unless Ganso moves farther back which is a wastE)

i was thinking more about the call up today.. but i forget that players from SP cant be on it..

in 2014..

julio cesar
maicon-tsilva-d.luiz-???
elias-hernanes
ramirez-ganso-(neymar)kleber
keirrison

dont know.. is too far away..

Sven said:
Interesting, Mano loves the Spain's 4-2-3-1 since his Grêmio days. He was using it at Corinthians too. Maybe he will try in Seleção?

you right.. he loved the 4-2-3-1.. but i think spain was more about the 4-4-2.. with villa and one striker up front..
mano give up the 4-2-3-1 early this year.. lets see if he'll try in NT again, if he do, will just continuin the dunga squeme, but atleast will move some pieces.

Senatore_M84 · Jul 26, 2010

Australiano1980 said:
you right.. he loved the 4-2-3-1.. but i think spain was more about the 4-4-2.. with villa and one striker up front..
mano give up the 4-2-3-1 early this year.. lets see if he'll try in NT again, if he do, will just continuin the dunga squeme, but atleast will move some pieces.

the thing about it was they played almost 4-2-2-2 as 4-4-2, 4 Central midfielders mostly, but all attacked and defended.... it wouldn't be like brazil 2006 where ronaldinho and kaka are not true midfielders.... Spain did it with xavi, iniesta and then DM's were xabi alonso, busquets which however lined up, still provided 4 true midfielders who would defend.

For me only differencer between the 4-4-2 and 4-2-3-1 was torres v. pedro (navas). When he played Torres, Villa played off of torres almost linking midfield. When he had villa as target man, pedro (or navas) more or less took role of second striker/psuedo winger. Tactically it wasn't THAT different, just players were different. The 4-4-2 w/ torres always looked more dangerous, cause as terrible as he was villa got himself into a million more goal scoring opportunities, where as when he was target man he was often non-existent and as we know, spains midfielders love to dwell on ball but rarely shoot. The tactic was brilliant for controlling game, they just weren't aggressive on shooting which i think was more to do with personnel as xavi, iniesta are not big time shooters (comparatively to other AMs)

so in that sense it might almost be...

pato--???

C.Eduardo-----Ganso
Hernanes---Jucilei
Defense

Obviously Brazil more than any country has the fb's to provide width for a narrow formation. For me this type of play is always way more interesting than standard 4-4-2 problem is it's HIGHLY difficult to implement as you need an extremely intelligent midfield who knows how to move in spaces and cover each other.... basically instead of width and duties you are depending upon there intelligence to attack and defend as a unit

Australiano1980 · Jul 26, 2010

Senatore_M84 said:
the thing about it was they played almost 4-2-2-2 as 4-4-2, 4 Central midfielders mostly, but all attacked and defended.... it wouldn't be like brazil 2006 where ronaldinho and kaka are not true midfielders.... Spain did it with xavi, iniesta and then DM's were xabi alonso, busquets which however lined up, still provided 4 true midfielders who would defend.

For me only differencer between the 4-4-2 and 4-2-3-1 was torres v. pedro (navas). When he played Torres, Villa played off of torres almost linking midfield. When he had villa as target man, pedro (or navas) more or less took role of second striker/psuedo winger. Tactically it wasn't THAT different, just players were different. The 4-4-2 w/ torres always looked more dangerous, cause as terrible as he was villa got himself into a million more goal scoring opportunities, where as when he was target man he was often non-existent and as we know, spains midfielders love to dwell on ball but rarely shoot. The tactic was brilliant for controlling game, they just weren't aggressive on shooting which i think was more to do with personnel as xavi, iniesta are not big time shooters (comparatively to other AMs)

so in that sense it might almost be...

pato--???

C.Eduardo-----Ganso
Hernanes---Jucilei
Defense

Obviously Brazil more than any country has the fb's to provide width for a narrow formation. For me this type of play is always way more interesting than standard 4-4-2 problem is it's HIGHLY difficult to implement as you need an extremely intelligent midfield who knows how to move in spaces and cover each other.... basically instead of width and duties you are depending upon there intelligence to attack and defend as a unit

hehe i forgot about pato.. but i still believe in keirrison.. i think when he get his second chance in europe, he wont missed.

i agree with you in the observations about spain.. but none of them is what i like.. i like a 4-3-3.. brazil 70, more recently barcelona made it work.. but if you dont have strikers that helps marking, is a dumb squeme to play in this days.

anyway.. in 1h and half mano will do his first call up.

Senatore_M84 · Jul 26, 2010

Australiano1980 said:
hehe i forgot about pato.. but i still believe in keirrison.. i think when he get his second chance in europe, he wont missed.

i agree with you in the observations about spain.. but none of them is what i like.. i like a 4-3-3.. brazil 70, more recently barcelona made it work.. but if you dont have strikers that helps marking, is a dumb squeme to play in this days.

anyway.. in 1h and half mano will do his first call up.

it's likely no European based players will be called up, no?

I think brazil is still probably more suited for a 4-3-1-2 or 4-4-2. Lots more forwards, AMs and CMs/DMs than wide winger attackers.

It'll be nice change to see from neutral perspective. Dunga's team annoyed me. not because his pragmatic football wasn't effective but cause he kept so many exciting players off the team in favor of mediocre crap like the beast, and unlike other countries he has talent pool to play better

Australiano1980 · Jul 26, 2010

Senatore_M84 said:
it's likely no European based players will be called up, no?

I think brazil is still probably more suited for a 4-3-1-2 or 4-4-2. Lots more forwards, AMs and CMs/DMs than wide winger attackers.

It'll be nice change to see from neutral perspective. Dunga's team annoyed me. not because his pragmatic football wasn't effective but cause he kept so many exciting players off the team in favor of mediocre crap like the beast, and unlike other countries he has talent pool to play better

yeah.. but i think the talk with mano was something about put together a great team.. with a beutifull football, you know.. the choices of muricy and mano, already show that CBF is thinking differently about football.. dunga did a good job, but his team dont have much stars like CBF wanted, Brazil's NT is like rock band.. ppl pay big money to see.. Ronaldo's, Kaka's.. no to see Josue, Mineiro, Gilberto Silva..

I prefer now for brazil.. a 4-3-1-2.. Cadu and Ganso(whatever) doing the function behing the strikers would be awsome.. Pato has to show more motivation to be on NT, his mind is in other things right now.. the defense is ok, t.silva, d.luiz, t.heleno.. on left back wesley looks like the one.

will be nice to see a domestic NT of brazil

Senatore_M84 · Jul 26, 2010

well even beyond that, it's always coaches job to build a balanced team that can win. And while Dunga's team was a force he left home so many elements which could ahve proved useful.

none of his CMs could control a game, like you said before. They had a player who could calm a game like Pirlo, they could have beat Dutch. Hernanes seems the obvious choice, but dunga was so set in just muscle and counter speed he left no ability to play another way. Considering all the options he has, i always found that stupid. Just like not taking ronaldinho. Sure he is tactical difference from your preferred 11. but you can't tell me he wouldn't have made a difference as a sub instead of baptista or grafite

Stubbornness is never a good trait in a coach. Be Strict, uncompromising, but not stubborn... there is a difference

Australiano1980 · Jul 26, 2010

http://sportv.globo.com/videos/v/é-gol!!!---26-de-julho/1307177/#/Programas/É Gol football program

goals from 11th of brasileirao > http://esporte.uol.com.br/ultimas/m...a-do-campeonato-brasileiro-0402183462C4A173A6

Australiano1980 · Jul 26, 2010

Senatore_M84 said:
well even beyond that, it's always coaches job to build a balanced team that can win. And while Dunga's team was a force he left home so many elements which could ahve proved useful.

none of his CMs could control a game, like you said before. They had a player who could calm a game like Pirlo, they could have beat Dutch. Hernanes seems the obvious choice, but dunga was so set in just muscle and counter speed he left no ability to play another way. Considering all the options he has, i always found that stupid. Just like not taking ronaldinho. Sure he is tactical difference from your preferred 11. but you can't tell me he wouldn't have made a difference as a sub instead of baptista or grafite

Stubbornness is never a good trait in a coach. Be Strict, uncompromising, but not stubborn... there is a difference

for sure.

Australiano1980 · Jul 26, 2010

manomenezes on twitter 2 minutes ago

"Estou chegando com o pres. Ricardo Teixeira ao local da coletiva de apresentação e da convocação dos jogadores para o amistoso nos EUA."

"arriving with the pres. Ricardo Teixeira on the place to made press conference and the call up..."

LIVE CALL UP >> http://globoesporte.globo.com/futeb...nvocacao+ao+vivo&utm_campaign=globoesportecom

Australiano1980 · Jul 26, 2010

tardelli dont deserv it.

Australiano1980 · Jul 26, 2010

Convocação: Alexandre Pato (MIL), André (SAN), André Santos (FEN), Carlos Eduardo (HOF), Daniel Alves (BAR), David Luís (BEN), Tardelli,
Ederson (LYon), Hernanes (SPO), Jefferson (BOT), Jucilei (COR), Lucas (LIV), Marcelo (REAL), Neymar (SAN), Rafael (MAN), Ramires (BEN),
Renan (AVA), Rever (CAM), Robinho (SAN), Sandro (INT), Tiago Silva (MIL), Vitor (GRE), Ganso (SAN) e Henrique (BAR)

my domestic team got screwed.

Senatore_M84 · Jul 26, 2010

Australiano1980 said:
Convocação: Alexandre Pato (MIL), André (SAN), André Santos (FEN), Carlos Eduardo (HOF), Daniel Alves (BAR), David Luís (BEN), Tardelli,
Ederson (LYon), Hernanes (SPO), Jefferson (BOT), Jucilei (COR), Lucas (LIV), Marcelo (REAL), Neymar (SAN), Rafael (MAN), Ramires (BEN),
Renan (AVA), Rever (CAM), Robinho (SAN), Sandro (INT), Tiago Silva (MIL), Vitor (GRE), Ganso (SAN) e Henrique (BAR)

my domestic team got screwed.

well 3 of our 'transfer targets' fees will just end up doubling overnight.

Congrats Pato1

Australiano1980 · Jul 26, 2010

Goleiros:
Renan (Avaí), Victor (Grêmio) e Jefferson (Botafogo)

Laterais:
Rafael (Manchester United), Daniel Alves (Barcelona), André Santos (Fenerbahce) e Marcelo (Real Madrid)

Zagueiros:
Réver (Atlético-MG), Henrique (Racing Santander), David Luiz (Benfica) e Thiago Silva (Milan)

Volantes:
Sandro (Internacional), Hernanes (São Paulo), Jucilei (Corinthians), Lucas (Liverpool) e Ramires (Benfica)

Meias:
Éderson (Lyon), Carlos Eduardo (Hoffenheim) e Paulo Henrique Ganso (Santos)

Atacantes:
Alexandre Pato (Milan), André (Santos), Diego Tardelli (Atlético-MG), Neymar (Santos) e Robinho (Santos)

Australiano1980 · Jul 26, 2010

Senatore_M84 said:
well 3 of our 'transfer targets' fees will just end up doubling overnight.

Congrats Pato1

very promissing team tho..

have the spine of the team that loses the world cup U-20 in 2007 with david luiz, lucas(cap) and pato.

is on the right way.

Ashish · Jul 26, 2010

I like this coach isnt he worked really hard with ronaldo? He knows how to handle players, 30 goals from a crippled fat ronaldo is awesome, time to step up pato , silva is going to be defensive leader and pato the offensive.

these two lads are the future of brasil and milan hope we shackle them with an ironclad agreement for millenniums to come.

we need midfielders the ones which used to rule europe, if only we had gou :cry:

oh he has weak mentality but i loved him i so loved him his touch his simpleness remotely resembledthe great zidane :cry:

we need to bring a young CAM who can run.

congrats Pato :star:

time to fly high

SpartanMilan · Jul 26, 2010

so what will they run? something like-

----------------Victor---------------
---Alves---Silva---Luiz---Santos--
---Rameres--Hernanes--Jucilei---
---------------Ganso--------------
-------Pato------------Robinho----

that would be a sick nasty midfield, so much running, and that is a ton of speed up top. I hope this is the lineup we see, it would be fun to watch all that movement. and that would be the fasted back four too... awesome

Sonny.Bill.Williams · Jul 26, 2010

defence is weak compared to what they had +no midfield cover ...surprised ,why no Filipe Luis ...is he still injured ?

Sven · Jul 26, 2010

Depending on who goes to final between São Paulo and Inter, Sandro or Hernanes will be out.

Overall I like it. I just would not let Maicon out of the squad.

ww · Jul 27, 2010

Holy shit, this attack sucks! Neymar and Robinho! LOL! i hope Bob Bradley calls Onyewuo to dig these weak bitches in the grass!

Is Henrique the one who played for Palmeiras? Because if it is, LOL! Such a fucked up bamboo who got flattered because doesn't commit fouls. HAHA! Like it was a reason to be appreciated!

It's happening what I think it would happen. Mano is being pushed to make a beautiful team just because now everyone thinks that Dunga was wrong.

I hope that USA fuck with Brazil's ass! If USA can only do it in politics and economy than what a useless country they are.

Anyway, I would go with:

--------------------Victor------------------------------
Alves-----Réver----------Thiago Silva---David Luiz
-----------------Sandro/Lucas------------------------
----------Ramires------Hernanes/Carlos Eduardo-----
--------------------Ganso---------------------------------
--------------Pato-------Tardelli-----------------

Lucas/Sandro and Hernanes/Carlos Eduardo since they can't play together because of Libertadores.

At least Mano will be abble to form this super-midfield that in my opinion is the best of the world. What a fucking diamond! Nothing is lacking! The players are perfect for it!

I hope that Hulk does a great season by Porto and Adriano the same by Rome to take these pussies out of the seleção.

Robinho and Neymar, lol, what the fuck is that? Ballet? Even ballet girls might lift more weight at the bench.

Sven · Jul 27, 2010

Renan has just 11 games as a professional player. This must be a new record or something. Maybe Mano want him ready for the Olympics?
Diego Alves deserves a chance here...

ww · Jul 27, 2010

Hulk's goal against Sampdoria, yesterday. The long shot.

That's how a badass player comes back from the vacation!

Ghisolfa · Jul 27, 2010

Australiano1980 said:
Goleiros:
Renan (Avaí), Victor (Grêmio) e Jefferson (Botafogo)

Laterais:
Rafael (Manchester United), Daniel Alves (Barcelona), André Santos (Fenerbahce) e Marcelo (Real Madrid)

Zagueiros:
Réver (Atlético-MG), Henrique (Racing Santander), David Luiz (Benfica) e Thiago Silva (Milan)

Volantes:
Sandro (Internacional), Hernanes (São Paulo), Jucilei (Corinthians), Lucas (Liverpool) e Ramires (Benfica)

Meias:
Éderson (Lyon), Carlos Eduardo (Hoffenheim) e Paulo Henrique Ganso (Santos)

Atacantes:
Alexandre Pato (Milan), André (Santos), Diego Tardelli (Atlético-MG), Neymar (Santos) e Robinho (Santos)

Oh my.........

I'm too excited. He made all of the right decisions for this match. Instead of the Robinho-Neymar-Ganso trio that makes Santos the most fun team in the world, we coudl see a starting attack of Robinho, Ganso, and PATO!!!

Of course the whole world knows about Ramires by now, but Ederson, Carlos Eduardo, Hernanes, Jucilei, and SANDRO all getting the call. It's not even fair, Brazil is so stacked! They could win the world cup with their 3rd XI in 2014. Unbelievable.

USA, get ready to see some SAMBA!!! Definitely getting tickets for this one now, Meadowlands is not too far from where I am living...

Australiano1980 · Jul 27, 2010

San Pato said:
defence is weak compared to what they had +no midfield cover ...surprised ,why no Filipe Luis ...is he still injured ?

he is fine.. only not fit.

Capitão Lugano said:
Holy shit, this attack sucks! Neymar and Robinho! LOL! i hope Bob Bradley calls Onyewuo to dig these weak bitches in the grass!

Is Henrique the one who played for Palmeiras? Because if it is, LOL! Such a fucked up bamboo who got flattered because doesn't commit fouls. HAHA! Like it was a reason to be appreciated!

It's happening what I think it would happen. Mano is being pushed to make a beautiful team just because now everyone thinks that Dunga was wrong.

I hope that USA fuck with Brazil's ass! If USA can only do it in politics and economy than what a useless country they are.

Anyway, I would go with:

--------------------Victor------------------------------
Alves-----Réver----------Thiago Silva---David Luiz
-----------------Sandro/Lucas------------------------
----------Ramires------Hernanes/Carlos Eduardo-----
--------------------Ganso---------------------------------
--------------Pato-------Tardelli-----------------

Lucas/Sandro and Hernanes/Carlos Eduardo since they can't play together because of Libertadores.

At least Mano will be abble to form this super-midfield that in my opinion is the best of the world. What a fucking diamond! Nothing is lacking! The players are perfect for it!

I hope that Hulk does a great season by Porto and Adriano the same by Rome to take these pussies out of the seleção.

Robinho and Neymar, lol, what the fuck is that? Ballet? Even ballet girls might lift more weight at the bench.

i like henrique.. did very well in palmeiras.. is not doing well on his first passage in europe.. but he has quality.

cadu plays more in front.. as trequartista or winger or SS.

ww · Jul 27, 2010

Australiano1980 said:
he is fine.. only not fit.

i like henrique.. did very well in palmeiras.. is not doing well on his first passage in europe.. but he has quality.

cadu plays more in front.. as trequartista or winger or SS.

I don't like Henrique at all. I hate those defenders who get flattered because don't have balls enough to make fouls. It's awful how in Brazil everyone mistread players like Ronaldão and suck the dicks of players like Gamarra.

If Ambrosini was brazilian, he would probably be playing at Serie B because no one would give a shit about him,

One reason that Juventus have to be proud is the defenders they had this decade. Cannavaro, Thuram, Montero and Iuliano. Sure I always cheered against Juventus but I always thought "shit, it's just great to see these defenders destroying their adversaries".

My gremista friend said that Carlos Eduardo was used as MC in some games last season and did well. I didn't know he could perform like that either.

KujaIX · Jul 27, 2010

Nice to see Pato get the call-up. Hopefully he fights his way into the squad and becomes a staple of it without a biased fuck like Dunga in charge.

MassterMark · Jul 27, 2010

thx ac milan, thx menezes.

now when hernanes, ganso & neymar are in brazil NT, we wont get anyone of them... :mad:

btw, when are brazil friendlies??

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