English Premier League Thread II

Zeusftw · Oct 28, 2011

manutd fan said:
I think you've missed the point. Suarez (according to the article) called Evra a negro in the heat of an arguement - in other words, it was almost certainly used as, or atleast part of, an insult.

ya thats like me arguing with a chinese person and saying "urgh chinese". it's not racist. the person is chinese therefore calling them chinese is true and a fact.

manutd fan · Oct 28, 2011

Mateoftw said:
ya thats like me arguing with a chinese person and saying "urgh chinese". it's not racist. the person is chinese therefore calling them chinese is true and a fact.

In the context of an arguement it's nothing like that. Suarez and Evra were insulting eachother.

akewander · Oct 28, 2011

suarez is a cunt, and im pretty sure if you were to walk down oxford street in london and call someone a negro in an argument u would get laid the fuck out. also negro is derived from the latin word n****. like neutral said in urguay it may be ok, but in this part of the world it isnt.

sadly the terry incident like manutdfan said will just sweep this under the crapet.

Senatore_M84 · Oct 28, 2011

akewander said:
suarez is a cunt, and im pretty sure if you were to walk down oxford street in london and call someone a negro in an argument u would get laid the fuck out. also negro is derived from the latin word n****. like neutral said in urguay it may be ok, but in this part of the world it isnt.

sadly the terry incident like manutdfan said will just sweep this under the crapet.

your ignorance is amazing! :star:

The word Negro is used in the English-speaking world to refer to a person of black ancestry or appearance, whether of African descent or not. The word negro means 'black' in Spanish and Portuguese, from the Latin niger, 'black', probably from a Proto-Indo-European root *nekw-, 'to be dark', akin to *nokw- 'night'.[1][2]

It literally means black

blanco- white
rojo- red
amarillo- yellow
negro- black

No racism. Just a fucking color. Racism is if you attach it to something like negro de mierda

In Spain, Mexico and almost all of Latin-America, negro (note that ethnonyms, names of nationalities, etc. are generally not capitalized in Romance languages) means "black person" in colloquial situations, but it can be considered to be derogatory in other situations (as in English, "black" is often used to mean irregular or undesirable, as in "black market/mercado negro"). However, in Spanish-speaking countries such as Argentina, Chile, and Uruguay where there are few people of African origin and appearance, negro (negra for females) is commonly used to refer to partners, close friends[13] or people in general independent of skin color. In Venezuela the word negro is similarly used, despite its large African descent population.

It is similar to the use of the word "*****" in urban communities in the United States. For example, one might say to a friend, "Negro ¿Como andas? (literally "Hey, black one, how are you doing?"). In this case, the diminutive negrito is used, as a term of endearment meaning "pal", "buddy" or "friend". Negrito has come to be used to refer to a person of any ethnicity or color, and also can have a sentimental or romantic connotation similar to "sweetheart," or "dear" in English (in the Philippines, negrito was used for a local dark-skinned short person, living in the Negros islands among other places).

In other Spanish-speaking South American countries, the word negro can also be employed in a roughly equivalent form, though it is not usually considered to be as widespread as in Argentina or Uruguay (except perhaps in a limited regional and/or social context).
Moreno[14] can be used as a euphemism but it also means just "tanned" or brunette.

I suggest you don't talk about words or regions you've never visited nor know anything about culturally. You sound ignorant.

PS- latino kids (because schools can be somewhat segregated in california and when you played a team from a predominantly latino area, the whole fucking team is latino) would always call me moreno when playing competitive games

pps- C4M's dog is named negrito. That racist bitch...

ppps- MU fan, this is pretty much what c4m wrote a page back, negro is a term of endearment. Not necessarily like Evra is his friend but haven't you ever said to someone on a pitch 'buddy, calm down, Hey BRO stop the fouling'. Besides you heard Suarez speak english? He knows like 10-15 words total.

if evra was actually fluent in spanish he'd know this. I knew this and my spanish is conversational.... i wouldn't say fluent by any means

crazy4milan · Oct 28, 2011

Senatore_M84 said:
pps- C4M's dog is named negrito. That racist bitch...

ppps- MU fan, this is pretty much what c4m wrote a page back, negro is a term of endearment. Not necessarily like Evra is his friend but haven't you ever said to someone on a pitch 'buddy, calm down, Hey BRO stop the fouling'

if evra was actually fluent in spanish he'd know this. I knew this and my spanish is conversational.... i wouldn't say fluent by any means

Pretty much this. I'm seriously looking back and thinking god actually it's such a common term, my cousin who we all call "el negro", my dad calls one of his sisters "negra", my uncle calls mom "negra", my mom calls my brother "negro", my friend calls her bf "mi negro",we call my sister and my brother's babysitter "La negra", I have a friend who we all call "negro"...Last Wednesday, was watching 400 mts athletism of the Panamericans, and I started shouting "vamos negro, vamos negro, vamos" to Nery Brenes (who won gold)...(it's is the same thing I did with our one olympic gold winner Claudia Poll "vamos macha, vamos!").

Like I said, in spanish negro is NOT racist, it will only be racist if you don't understand the language and you thought it was "nigro-neegro" (btw there's a last name Nigro in spanish, had an annoying classmate in high school who's last name was that). It's the same thing with "moro".

akewander · Oct 28, 2011

Senatore_M84 said:
your ignorance is amazing!

well thats simple then, prove me wrong, go pick a fight with a balck guy and call him a negro. this is england, this aint spain.

Sage · Oct 28, 2011

so m84 gets all unicef when I called gragano a m*****, but he's defending suarez for insulting and racially abusing evra?

LOL hypocrite :lol:

crazy4milan · Oct 28, 2011

akewander said:
well thats simple then, prove me wrong, go pick a fight with a balck guy and call him a negro. this is england, this aint spain.

Well then the problem is simple ignorance of the fact that the word negro in England, is still a spanish word that's not racist, and it's meaning doesn't change in any country cause it's still a spanish word.

Senatore_M84 · Oct 28, 2011

Sage said:
so m84 gets all unicef when I called gragano a m*****, but he's defending suarez for insulting and racially abusing evra?

Monkey's a racist term. It's actually very offensive.

'Negro' by itself is not.

Sven, C4M, Austaliano all the latin american posters will back that claim.
---

Do you even know the history of the term? It's meant to de-humanize indigenous people of a region, be it africa or americas but white colonialists. Treat them like animals, say they LOOK like animals. That is why Monkey is unacceptable. I don't give a shit how much someone looks like one... it's a major racial insult

akewander said:
well thats simple then, prove me wrong, go pick a fight with a balck guy and call him a negro. this is england, this aint spain.

He called him negro, not A NEGRO. Fact you don't understand the term, much less the useage.

for the last time- negro, literally means the color black. It has no relation to n-gger. It just means black. Like Blanco means white.

AND FOR THE LAST TIME- I'M NOT DEFENDING SUAREZ. I JUST SAID THAT ARTICLES NOTHING RACIST. THE TERM NEGRO IS NOT RACIST ALONE

and ignorance isn't cool

Sage · Oct 28, 2011

Senatore_M84 said:
Monkey's a racist term.

Negro is not.

Sven, C4M, Austaliano all the latin american posters will back that claim.

LOL, and why would suarez just call evra black in a heated argument? he obviously meant it in a racist tone.

they can back the claim that negro means black, but its pretty damn obvious for anyone who is not a suarez fan boy that the cunt meant it in an racist tone.

this is ridiculous LOL :lol:

Senatore_M84 · Oct 28, 2011

Sage said:
LOL, and why would suarez just call evra black in a heated argument? he obviously meant it in a racist tone.

they can back the claim that negro means black, but its pretty damn obvious for anyone who is not a suarez fan boy that the cunt meant it in an racist tone.

this is ridiculous LOL

are you literate? Read C4M's post

Read my post which quotes uruguay and argentina

Negro is not racist, Now apologize to me, now

I'm really tired of this... people skirting facts.

akewander · Oct 28, 2011

crazy4milan said:
Well then the problem is simple ignorance of the fact that the word negro in England, is still a spanish word that's not racist, and it's meaning doesn't change in any country cause it's still a spanish word.

u can apply that to suarez as well then, he is ignorant of the fact that calling someone a negro is regarded as racist in england.

the same thing that neutral pointed out yet im the ignorant fucker :lol:

edit: the use of any such word on a football pitch should be out of the question, but hey im ignorant so i dont know shit :lol:

crazy4milan · Oct 28, 2011

Sage said:
LOL, and why would suarez just call evra black in a heated argument? he obviously meant it in a racist tone.

they can back the claim that negro means black, but its pretty damn obvious for anyone who is not a suarez fan boy that the cunt meant it in an racist tone.

this is ridiculous LOL

No latino will ever just say "negro" to imply something racist (to explain it in a crude way, negro doesn't really give in anything racial nor is it insulting, which if he's trying to be racist is what he's aiming for, to insult and by just saying negro he's not getting to that). They'll say negro + derogatory adjective or simply "mono".

akewander said:
u can apply that to suarez as well then, he is ignorant of the fact that calling someone a negro is regarded as racist in england.

the same thing that neutral pointed out yet im the ignorant fucker

edit: the use of any such word on a football pitch should be out of the question, but hey im ignorant so i dont know shit

Negro is not nigro man. We're not discussing the same word.

Seriously all this is just a lost in translation bit, I do think Suárez should be more careful next time, just cause it can be misinterpreted, but that's not racist.

Sage · Oct 28, 2011

Senatore_M84 said:
are you literate? Read C4M's post

Read my post which quotes uruguay and argentina

Negro is not racist, you moron

Now apologize to me, now

why? she's probably just repeating what you said :lol:

dont care about uruguay and argentina

I think I made it clear that I understand that the word negro means black, but suarez's way of using it against evra is 100% racist :lol:

in your dreams :lol:

these facts don't matter when the intention is obviously used to hurt evra.

Senatore_M84 · Oct 28, 2011

Sage said:
why? she's probably just repeating what you said

dont care about uruguay and argentina

I think I made it clear that I understand that the word negro means black, but suarez's way of using it against evra is 100% racist

in your dreams idiot

you think you know more about latino's than a person who is latin american (C4M)?

or someone who lives in a state which is majority latino, and lives among them (me)? Do you speak any spanish? Have any experiencE?

---

so how about instead of your 'i know' attitude, admit you don't know 1 thing about latin american culture and apologize for insults just like you like others to do with Arab world. Ones who don't live there

negro, is a term of endearment in uruguay. It's like 'buddy' or 'bro'.

It's only racist if you attach something like puta or mierda or something which is an insult. Mono on the otherhand is always racist.

acmilan4ever · Oct 28, 2011

Anyone got a video of this incident, please post the link.

Btw, not defending Suarez but the word "negro" in the Spanish language cant be interpret as a racist term unless there was some other words used along with it like "puta" or "maricon/pendejo", then yes. Anyways, haven't seen the video but I would like to so someone post it.

Edit: Both have had controversies in the past, I believe Evra has played this racism card before in France long back during his Monaco days then there was some Chelsea incident and Suarez had been banned for some 12 games for biting Bakkal :lol:

I think the media is enjoying the most from this situation, the PFA should just quickly do their thing and get the verdict over with.

Sage · Oct 28, 2011

I don't care what they do or what they say in latin american, the fact is, suarez obviously used it to insult evra and there's claims of him saying it 10 times.

I'm pretty sure suarez knows what the word negro can mean as well when using it against evra, so it's pretty ignorant on your part to just claim its ok because it only means "black".

he used it loads of times in a heated verbal fight, I hardly think he meant it as buddy or bro :lol:

and the fact that suarez is a prick doesn't really help his case.

necromancer said:
"Evra claims this word from Suarez was said 10 times – and that is *systematic racial abuse if it is true. At the very least, Liverpool and United should be starting an investigation".

http://www.liverpool-kop.com/2011/10/suarez-evra-im-as-angry-now-as-i-was-at.html

Senior FA officials have contacted both clubs and asked for them not to talk about the matter while the investigation is under way into Evra's allegations that he was called a "******" at least ten times during the 1-1 draw at Anfield last Saturday.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2011/oct/22/luis-suarez-patrice-evra-fa?newsfeed=true

crazy4milan · Oct 28, 2011

I'm just saying if all Evra has is the word "negro" and nothing more...it doesn't really have much of an argument to be deemed as racist. If there's something more (it doesn't even have to be mierda or puta, but something like "tenía que ser negro", then yeah that changes everything).

acmilan4ever · Oct 28, 2011

Sage said:
I don't care what they do or what they say in latin american, the fact is, suarez obviously used it to insult evra and there's claims of him saying it 10 times.

I agree, Suarez comes across as a dirty player but I think the "10 times" is blowing the matter out of proportion.

Anyways couldn't care less if both got suspended.

necromancer · Oct 28, 2011

Sage said:
these facts don't matter when the intention is obviously used to hurt evra.

This is clearly the nub of the issue and the fundamental thing that any court of arbitration should and would look at.

Every other explanation/argument here is pointless.

crazy4milan · Oct 28, 2011

necromancer said:
This is clearly the nub of the issue and the fundamental thing that any court of arbitration should and would look at.

Every other explanation/argument here is pointless.

Evra's past claims also come into play, he has played the card before and has never really had much to sustain it with (and this is a "i say vs he says argument").

Senatore_M84 · Oct 28, 2011

crazy4milan said:
I'm just saying if all Evra has is the word "negro" and nothing more...it doesn't really have much of an argument to be deemed as racist. If there's something more (it doesn't even have to be mierda or puta, but something like "tenía que ser negro", then yeah that changes everything).

basically what i'm saying....

negro itself means nothing derogatory.

necromancer · Oct 28, 2011

crazy4milan said:
Evra's past claims also come into play, he has played the card before and has never really had much to sustain it with (and this is a "i say vs he says argument").

True, that'll come into the picture as well. I've never liked Evra, and he comes across as a prick, but this time he is lucky to have a prickier guy on the other side.

As manutdfan said though, the Terry issue might overshadow this and naught might come off it after all.

Suarez is really not doing the right things at this early stage of his career. Gigantic ass.

Senatore_M84 · Oct 28, 2011

necromancer said:
This is clearly the nub of the issue and the fundamental thing that any court of arbitration should and would look at.

Every other explanation/argument here is pointless.

Agreed. And the whole point is the word negro alone doesn't really give us any insight into that.

It could have been 'tu eres un negro de mierda' (you are a black shit- that's racist)

or it could have been "Negro, gracias por tirar mi camiseta

" "Bro, thanx for pulling my shirt

" Asshole remark? Yes. Racist? No.

The word Negro has no racist connotation in latin america. It's how you use it. It can be used in a statement to be racist. But it's not the word which is racist, if that makes sense.

All I'm trying to clear up is, the word negro, is poor press, trying to insite an ignorant english base who wouldn't know any better...

I'm not saying Suarez was racist or wasn't Just that the word negro literally tells us nothing..

go down to post by pitiburi- http://www.lfcreds.com/reds/index.php/topic,36074.1440.html

Guys, I happen to be Uruguayan, and I work in football. Now I live in Europe, still working in football.

I wanted to explain something most of you guys may not know. In spanish, saying "negro" is not an insult. Not at all. In fact, in Uruguay it is a colloquial term that is used in the same way the americans use the word "dude". So, "What's up, dude?" is "¿Qué pasa, negro?". It is a usual way to call friends or pals in both Uruguay and Argentina. Many very famous people has "Negro" as their nicknames. And it has nothing to do with being black skinned, let alone with an insult. Just google "Negro Fontova", "Negro Olmedo", "Negro Dolina" or "Negro Alvarez". They are not even black skinned, as most of people nicknamed "negro". Just go and do it, you will see what I'm saying. It is also used as a nice way to call your partner ("Negra" or "Negro"). Hell, *I* use it for sure to talk with other uruguayans or argentinians if I find them on the streets of europe.

So, I have not seeing the action, but I am mostly sure that Luis DID say "negro", because it is a very usual word for us, it is not offensive at all, and I know he uses to speak in spanish when he is in the field. Luis is very used to abuse -in spanish- referees, always. It makes me laugh each and every time I see a Liverpool match, because he really insults so much the referees, sooo much. But never, not even once was he racially offensive to anyone; we mostly concentrate on families when insulting, and that is what he usually does. What we, uruguayans, use to react when angry. Not like we really think the mother of the referee gets paid for sexual encounters with other men. It is just a way to show disagreement in a very strong way, that is all.
In spanish, by the way, the pronunciation of "negro" is with the "e" like the first "e" in "better" and the "o" as in "hostile". It means just "black", and again, in Argentina and Uruguay has the meaning of "dude". Most people nicknamed "Negro" are white skinned.

In my family they call me "Negro". I am as black as Kuyt.

Whether this guy is legitimate or not... who knows, but it goes in line with everything C4M (who is latin american) says.... everything I've experienced with latinos...

hdcantona · Oct 28, 2011

it is weird that Suarez first denied it completely, now claims it's some sort of language barrier issue...

Senatore_M84 · Oct 28, 2011

hdcantona said:
it is weird that Suarez first denied it completely, now claims it's some sort of language barrier issue...

How is that weird? He claimed he never used a racist term etc. He's not racist etc. Then when they told him what he said he said 'oh it's a language barrier cause that's not racist in latin america'

makes complete sense to me

hdcantona · Oct 28, 2011

Senatore_M84 said:
How is that weird? He claimed he never used a racist term etc. He's not racist etc. Then when they told him what he said he said 'oh it's a language barrier cause that's not racist in latin america'

makes complete sense to me

I thought his initial denials were that he'd said anything of the nature to evra, but I see what you mean, if he didn't consider it racist at all (which it isn't going on what c4m said - unless he added more) then he wouldn't think of it as racist.

A Wild Homosexual · Oct 29, 2011

Suarez isnt a racist since Liverpool isnt a strong club that might draw jealousy.
Barca on the other hand & maybe Madrid are kick ass teams hence what they say is racist , what they do is cheat & their game is diving.
Suarez just wanted to describe Evra's color in a fight.

Sage · Oct 29, 2011

I'd rather side with evra than side with some psycho prick who bites people :lol:

Kalac#16 · Oct 29, 2011

Language barrier issue? This is making incredible excuses for him now.

So you're telling me that in the year that Suarez has been in England he couldn't have possibly learned a racial slur? And that he was infact saying 'black' in Spanish over and over to Evra, who plays for a rival team, and it's widely known that Suarez is a dick. The reasoning for this is a load of shit.

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