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AC Milan History, Legends, Icons & Former Players Talk about the history of AC Milan or its legendary/ordinary former players.



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Old 15-11-2017, 08:35   #15341
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Originally Posted by Casualista View Post
Someone else already responded to this. And I'll add that Italy did fine in 2014 Euros without Pirlo.





Juve were outspending Milan and every other Italian team the day they returned back from Serie B. Their current financial strength came from owning their own stadium and having an owner that cares. The transfer record for Higuain was only possible because they got a fat wad of cash from the sale of Pogba (who joined Juve because of Raiola, not because they won the scudetto). Pirlo had zilch to do with any of that.



He was irrelevant at Milan post 07 and especially so in our scudetto winning season where he was injured in December.









This isn't 1930s. Your propaganda won't work here.


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On a side note, is Allegri the first coach to boot Pirlo out of his teams twice??

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Old 15-11-2017, 12:37   #15342
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Originally Posted by tuccero9 View Post
Italy never missed a big tournament for 60 years. this is not because of 1 man.
Italy was always there because it is Italy.
the only difference this time is ventura
Not only Ventura, but the quality of players. Also bad luck having Spain in the same group ... but no excuses for Sweden ...

Pirlo has been the linchpin for Italy for decades. Whichever coach came, he was one of the first players to be put on the team sheet.

Don't you recall 5 years ago when he was Italy's star in getting them to the final? Gerrard, Rooney and Co running circles around him? Kross, Ozil and crew also failing to lock down the maestro? It was only against Spain in the final where he wasn't as effective ... but the whole team kinda collapsed.

Or a more direct comparison ... if you had followed Italy's qualification during Pirlo's time with the Azzurri, he was always one of their most consistent performers and a key individual for most of their successful qualifications.

In fact, I can accept Pirlo having bad games for Milan during his time with us ... but for Italy, even during the left Island to Dinho era, he was exceptional for Italy.


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Old 15-11-2017, 13:00   #15343
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Originally Posted by Casualista View Post
Someone else already responded to this. And I'll add that Italy did fine in 2014 Euros without Pirlo.
Is that so?

Since we're talking about streaks coming to an end, specifically that of Italy not reaching the World Cup since '58, correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't that the first time Italy were defeated by Germany in competitive football?

Sure they reached the Semis, but they were also coached by a man who is arguably one of the best managers out there today who always seems to make most of the squad at his disposal ...

I would think while the results were favorable, the performances still not up to date of the previous generation Azzurri. Midfield and defense have weakened considerably ...

If you cannot see that players like Pirlo, Totti, Nesta and Co. haven't truly been replaced then there's no point discussing ...
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Juve were outspending Milan and every other Italian team the day they returned back from Serie B. Their current financial strength came from owning their own stadium and having an owner that cares. The transfer record for Higuain was only possible because they got a fat wad of cash from the sale of Pogba (who joined Juve because of Raiola, not because they won the scudetto). Pirlo had zilch to do with any of that.
Jeez ... you really have no clue of what you are talking about.

When Pirlo joined Juve, they had what ... 3-4 season of mediocrity similar to what we are facing ... few good performances, but nothing consistent.

Bring in Pirlo and he turned everything around for them with Conte a huge admirer. Easily the best player in Serie A that season, he ousted even the mighty Zlatan's domestic record/streak ...

That was the start of Juve's dominance, and if you don't know how difficult it is to start an era like that then ... well ... you don't know football.

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He was irrelevant at Milan post 07 and especially so in our scudetto winning season where he was injured in December.
Lets look at Milan's first game post Athens 07 ... Pirlo back heels the ball to free up Gattuso who delivers a cross for Pippo to equalize ... there's a clash of heads and Gattuso goes down with Kieta (faking it) and has to be taken off for treatment - Milan given the freekick. While still a man down, Pirlo zips a sensational ball for Janku to volley ...

Or what about under Leo when were hopeless with Dinho as trequartista ... in Madrid, with that bullet of a shot that was so special it jump started our season and helped us finish third?

Speaking of bullets and your mentioning our Scudetto winning season ... didn't he single handedly give us three points with one from even further out?
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This isn't 1930s. Your propaganda won't work here.


=====

On a side note, is Allegri the first coach to boot Pirlo out of his teams twice??
Really? I thought he sought refuge in the empire Pirlo helped create.

Let him at least get his hands on big ears ... then only can you mention him in the same line as Pirlo.


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Old 15-11-2017, 13:02   #15344
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Originally Posted by Sage View Post
You still have farts in your brain? Thought you would've matured by now ...

Booting Pirlo out of Milan only to be humbled end of season with Pirlo lifting the Scudetto? Its thats being booted out, please ... let me be booted out as well


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Old 15-11-2017, 16:12   #15345
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Originally Posted by GreatKalu View Post
Is that so?

Since we're talking about streaks coming to an end, specifically that of Italy not reaching the World Cup since '58, correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't that the first time Italy were defeated by Germany in competitive football?
Correct me if I am wrong but are Italy the first champions to get ko-ed from world cup group stages two tournaments in a row with mighty Pirlo? And Italy losing to Germany was because of absence of Pirlo?

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I would think while the results were favorable, the performances still not up to date of the previous generation Azzurri. Midfield and defense have weakened considerably ...

If you cannot see that players like Pirlo, Totti, Nesta and Co. haven't truly been replaced then there's no point discussing ...
Oh so Pirlo and 10 other players. Ergo Pirlo not that important.





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Sure they reached the Semis, but they were also coached by a man who is arguably one of the best managers out there today who always seems to make most of the squad at his disposal ...
Quarters and yes, Conte is great. His managerial skills surpass any need for individuals like Pirlo.






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Jeez ... you really have no clue of what you are talking about.

When Pirlo joined Juve, they had what ... 3-4 season of mediocrity similar to what we are facing ... few good performances, but nothing consistent.

Bring in Pirlo and he turned everything around for them with Conte a huge admirer. Easily the best player in Serie A that season, he ousted even the mighty Zlatan's domestic record/streak ...

That was the start of Juve's dominance, and if you don't know how difficult it is to start an era like that then ... well ... you don't know football
Yes, Pirlo had one good season but Juve's prolonged dominance has nothing to do with him. It's because all their rivals stopped playing football. They could literally stick a random player like Padoin and not a thing would change for them in terms of result.


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Insert selected drivel about 4-5 Pirlo moments in 4 years of football
Too bad each season was 38+ games long unlike list of Pirlo's good performances.

On that note. Dinho on arrival was way better for Milan than Pirlo. He was right up there in the assist charts in Europe and he did it while being overweight and lazier than Pirlo.

Honestly, I thought Pirlo had disappeared into Park Ji-Sun's pockets before I heard news about Galliani not renewing his contract.

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Really? I thought he sought refuge in the empire Pirlo helped create.

Let him at least get his hands on big ears ... then only can you mention him in the same line as Pirlo.
You spelled Conte wrong.

And Pirlo should kiss the ground Allegri walks on for letting him step on the pitch of a European final again. Juve didn't even need him to beat Madrid in the semis or reach the finals last season. Before that he was being slapped silly by teams like Galatasaray.

Unfortunately, in the finals, just like most of his career, Barca midgets ran over him and left him for roadkill.

Last edited by Casualista; 16-11-2017 at 23:02.
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Old 15-11-2017, 16:46   #15346
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Pirlo was injured in WC 2010, came on in the second half of the last game in the group stages & Italy improved tenfold. Probably would have qualified if he was fit in the groups.
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Old 15-11-2017, 18:38   #15347
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Originally Posted by GreatKalu View Post
Not only Ventura, but the quality of players. Also bad luck having Spain in the same group ... but no excuses for Sweden ...

Pirlo has been the linchpin for Italy for decades. Whichever coach came, he was one of the first players to be put on the team sheet.

Don't you recall 5 years ago when he was Italy's star in getting them to the final? Gerrard, Rooney and Co running circles around him? Kross, Ozil and crew also failing to lock down the maestro? It was only against Spain in the final where he wasn't as effective ... but the whole team kinda collapsed.

Or a more direct comparison ... if you had followed Italy's qualification during Pirlo's time with the Azzurri, he was always one of their most consistent performers and a key individual for most of their successful qualifications.

In fact, I can accept Pirlo having bad games for Milan during his time with us ... but for Italy, even during the left Island to Dinho era, he was exceptional for Italy.
the whole point is to prove that Italy wasn't a one-man show when Pirlo as part of the squad.
euro 2016 is there. granted Italy had a great coach in euro 2016 but is not like Italy was ever short on quality of their coaches.
also I agree with you that the current squad do not have players of the same quality of totti, nesta, Pirlo etc. but this is another point that proves what I stated in my previous post. that Italy was not great because of 1 man. not because of Pirlo. there were a lot of players who contributed to that.
however, I feel the most guilty person for italys failure to reach world cup is ventura by far. the quality of this team is a lot greater that Sweden's.
but Sweden had a plan and play like a team. on the other hand Italy didn't know what to do.
I follow the Italian team and Italian football for many many years. pointing solely at Pirlo for the whole nations achievements is at best naive

Last edited by tuccero9; 15-11-2017 at 19:05.
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Old 15-11-2017, 21:30   #15348
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Originally Posted by GreatKalu View Post
You still have farts in your brain? Thought you would've matured by now ...

Booting Pirlo out of Milan only to be humbled end of season with Pirlo lifting the Scudetto? Its thats being booted out, please ... let me be booted out as well
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Old 15-11-2017, 21:33   #15349
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i dislike pirlo and would never call him a milan legend

but to not acknowledge his talent and contribution on the pitch for all his teams is just



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Old 16-11-2017, 19:32   #15350
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i dislike pirlo and would never call him a milan legend

but to not acknowledge his talent and contribution on the pitch for all his teams is just

i agree I think that's the most fair assessment to make here.
surely his quality is not up for debate but for me also is not a milan legend.
a club legend would never speak about his club the way Pirlo did
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Old 16-11-2017, 20:10   #15351
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Originally Posted by tuccero9 View Post
i agree I think that's the most fair assessment to make here.
surely his quality is not up for debate but for me also is not a milan legend.
a club legend would never speak about his club the way Pirlo did
Completely agree. Comes across like a bitter bastard.

Nesta: " I haven't read Pirlo's book yet, just what has been posted online, Anyways I don't have much to say but if Pirlo did say bad things about Milan that won't hurt the club's reputation at all.
A lot has criticized Milan before and yet Milan stayed like it is.
I just hope my friend Pirlo remembers all the glory and trophies he has achieved with the Rossoneri before writing those bad things about Milan."

Nesta, a true Milan legend.


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Old 29-11-2017, 15:22   #15352
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Originally Posted by Casualista View Post
Correct me if I am wrong but are Italy the first champions to get ko-ed from world cup group stages two tournaments in a row with mighty Pirlo?
Eh ... how many games did Pirlo play in WC 2010? 2014?

Compare that to the number of games Pirlo was 100% fit for Italy at Euro 2012.

Then, also compare the team performances of Italy with and without Pirlo ... I think its no secret to those knowledgeable in football that Pirlo was a very key player for Italy all through his career.
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And Italy losing to Germany was because of absence of Pirlo?
Nope but when the midfield general was running the show, be it Kross, Bastian or Ballack, all had to play to the maestro's tempo.

Conte did well to take Italy far, but the quality just wasn't there.
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Oh so Pirlo and 10 other players. Ergo Pirlo not that important.
Watch Italy v England Euro 2012 ... it rather seemed like Pirlo and 21 other players on the pitch ...
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Quarters and yes, Conte is great. His managerial skills surpass any need for individuals like Pirlo.
True, but he did request for him and is a well known admirer of Pirlo. Why would a great coach want such a average player?
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Yes, Pirlo had one good season but Juve's prolonged dominance has nothing to do with him. It's because all their rivals stopped playing football. They could literally stick a random player like Padoin and not a thing would change for them in terms of result.
We pushed them hard during his first season at Juve ... remember they were undefeated, so we also had a good season and was just unfortunate UEFA decided to give Barca penalties for free and ... that we let go of Pirlo who in turn was Juve's key player in ending their long Scudetto drought
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Too bad each season was 38+ games long unlike list of Pirlo's good performances.
More inaccurate facts.

Do you know that during our UCL winning 07 season, Pirlo played more minutes than anyone? I think it was Pirlo and Jankulovski who had amassed more minutes than anyone else.

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On that note. Dinho on arrival was way better for Milan than Pirlo. He was right up there in the assist charts in Europe and he did it while being overweight and lazier than Pirlo.
Haha ... explains everything ... Dinho and Ronaldo are some of the main mistakes made by the outgoing management that have led us to our current predicament.

In this aspect, yes ... Pirlo, Dinho and Ronaldo are quite similar albeit for on minor difference ... While the management bringing in Dinho and Ronaldo was a complete and utter travesty, the management on the other had made a massive mistake in letting Pirlo go the way he did and to the club he went to.
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Honestly, I thought Pirlo had disappeared into Park Ji-Sun's pockets before I heard news about Galliani not renewing his contract.
Really? And where did Dinho disappear to in those games against Manchester? Being outwitted by Gary Neville? LOL

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You spelled Conte wrong.
Couldn't care less.

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And Pirlo should kiss the ground Allegri walks on for letting him step on the pitch of a European final again. Juve didn't even need him to beat Madrid in the semis or reach the finals last season. Before that he was being slapped silly by teams like Galatasaray.
You aren't getting the point. Before Pirlo, Juve was a giant in the doldrums that we are kind of facing right now. Few good performances here and there but nothing consistent to lift them above midtable.

That whole trend was brought to an abrupt end when Pirlo dominated a Serie A where even the great Zlatan Ibrahimovic played.

Based on this consistency and new found belief, they have built a team which is formidable even on the continent now.

Rather than blindly criticizing out of hate, we could learn a thing or two from them
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Unfortunately, in the finals, just like most of his career, Barca midgets ran over him and left him for roadkill.
Can't win all the time.

He won some, he lost some. But his skill and legacy as a professional footballer are a model to upcoming footballers.

You too can look at him as a model ... sometimes you may feel out of place, or are written off as being too weak to do a certain task. Pirlo proved anything is possible if you put your mind to it ... cause unlike a fraud boss, Pirlo's signature has always been his capacity to protect the back four/three using skill, technique and vision, as opposed to the norm ...


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Last edited by GreatKalu; 29-11-2017 at 15:30.
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