Europa League - Group H: AC Milan vs Celtic 3/12/2020 18:55 CET

[Australiano1980]

Originally Posted by Pingu

I think it's time to remain with the 4231 that works so well for us instead of change it for no reason.

We need to form a team, the youngests can long a decade here, we gonna let them playing in a tactics that suits wingers only?
I mean.. atleast a Xmas tree.

Tonali, Bennacer and Kessie eventually will be playing together, let it be now that we have an advantage in the table.

Originally Posted by Goodfella

Thankfully, we no longer have an owner who'll fire coaches for not using 4-3-1-2.
RnB posters who advertently or inadvertently want 2012-2017 Milan back deserve to be ridiculed.

I don't mind seeing that either. The team needs to learn more than double pivot systems, although it should stay the primary formation.

My post was mostly directed at Australiano who seems to want Pioli fired because he isn't deploying a low risk low reward 4312. There's probably some bitterness over Paqueta involved as well.

We won everything playing 2 strikers. Whats wrong with that?
To play defensively and poorly, i do prefer 2 strikers always.

Why 2012-2017? Honda was right winger, Boateng was right winger,..

I dont want Pioli fired, i said that i support him as long he is our coach, what i said was that he is uncapable of setting up a solid defensive system. Even Ajer conducted the ball inside our box yesterday. Imo he is not the guy to bring back the glorys.
Not only my opinion, Milan' directors had in mind a all bunch of coaches in mind, none of them were Pioli. Ibra saved his skin.

Paqueta is a excelent player, had his chances.. what happened to him was fair.

Originally Posted by Fabio

I heard he doesnt like theo

I corrected that

i said that he is defensively unfocused and should be used more to attack than as a leftback. Also state that i totally understand why he hasnt got a call up for his NT, and the lack of effort in Madrid to hold him in. If im not wrong Milan went to Madrid after Reguilon, but i maybe wrong here.
Theo is a very good player. Piatek and Paqueta were also, so we never know.

[Tantalis]

Originally Posted by ChinaMilan

You are so stupid you cant even realise that our bench (krunic, dalot) were responsible for being 2 - 0 down within 15 minutes and it could have been 3- 0 if it werent for donna, and the lack of good replacement of CF ( cloombo, rebic) who did almost nothing the entire game.
an
If it was a decnet club like lille not useless celtic we would have lost this one big time.

Our only good area are the LW and maybe AM in diaz, the rest are not good enough for serie c clubs, if you cant see that then you are more stupid than i thought a human being can be.

Congrats you have won the surprise tie breaker!

You are now the sole winner of

match days biggest loser

Congratulations!

[Hitchens]

Originally Posted by Fabio

the halilovic of the forum

[nonsonoqui]

Originally Posted by ChinaMilan

You are so stupid you cant even realise that our bench (krunic, dalot) were responsible for being 2 - 0 down within 15 minutes and it could have been 3- 0 if it werent for donna, and the lack of good replacement of CF ( cloombo, rebic) who did almost nothing the entire game.
an
If it was a decnet club like lille not useless celtic we would have lost this one big time.

Our only good area are the LW and maybe AM in diaz, the rest are not good enough for serie c clubs, if you cant see that then you are more stupid than i thought a human being can be.

The problem is you take the dimmest view of the situation and present it as penetrating insight. It?s the oldest trick in the book and several have done it on this forum before you.

The other problem is you are too hung up on individuals when assessing our depth. I instead see a fluid system that allows mistakes and offsets the growth period for players. Yes, like Tonali, whom you hate but who is improving steadily.

I privilege the way we interpret how to play over assessing individual quality for this young Milan at least. I do that for a variety of reasons, the main one being that we have limited resources and despite that we have won our games without key players. We shuffle things around and make it work. This allows me not to get hung up on Krunic screwing up, for example. And this flexibility is our depth; not whether Krunic is an able replacement. I have adjusted my expectations. When we are rich, I will tweak them again.

[Milan10]

Originally Posted by Australiano1980

We need to form a team, the youngests can long a decade here, we gonna let them playing in a tactics that suits wingers only?
I mean.. atleast a Xmas tree.

Tonali, Bennacer and Kessie eventually will be playing together, let it be now that we have an advantage in the table.




We won everything playing 2 strikers. Whats wrong with that?
To play defensively and poorly, i do prefer 2 strikers always.

Why 2012-2017? Honda was right winger, Boateng was right winger,..

I dont want Pioli fired, i said that i support him as long he is our coach, what i said was that he is uncapable of setting up a solid defensive system. Even Ajer conducted the ball inside our box yesterday. Imo he is not the guy to bring back the glorys.
Not only my opinion, Milan' directors had in mind a all bunch of coaches in mind, none of them were Pioli. Ibra saved his skin.

Paqueta is a excelent player, had his chances.. what happened to him was fair.






I corrected that

i said that he is defensively unfocused and should be used more to attack than as a leftback. Also state that i totally understand why he hasnt got a call up for his NT, and the lack of effort in Madrid to hold him in. If im not wrong Milan went to Madrid after Reguilon, but i maybe wrong here.
Theo is a very good player. Piatek and Paqueta were also, so we never know.

We don?t have proper depth for our 2 man midfield, so I can assure you we won?t be switching to a 3 man midfield anytime soon... our only substitute for the entire midfield would be Krunic, man.

This system is awesome, I?m not sure why anyone would want to change. It works when we are missing our best players, it is aesthetically pleasing, we?ve lost a single match in 30 using it... And we are 5 points clear in Serie A.

Just keep adding young, talented players like we did last summer with Diaz, Tonali, Hawg, and Dalot. We are on a crazy upward trajectory and just need to keep adding pieces.

[Milan10]

Originally Posted by nonsonoqui

The problem is you take the dimmest view of the situation and present it as penetrating insight. It?s the oldest trick in the book and several have done it on this forum before you.

The other problem is you are too hung up on individuals when assessing our depth. I instead see a fluid system that allows mistakes and offsets the growth period for players. Yes, like Tonali, whom you hate but who is improving steadily.

I privilege the way we interpret how to play over assessing individual quality for this young Milan at least. I do that for a variety of reasons, the main one being that we have limited resources and despite that we have won our games without key players. We shuffle things around and make it work. This allows me not to get hung up on Krunic screwing up, for example. And this flexibility is our depth; not whether Krunic is an able replacement. I have adjusted my expectations. When we are rich, I will tweak them again.

It?s a strong system that can overcome individual errors as we saw yesterday. And like you said, you can plug green players like Tonali into the squad and it?s so strong and organized that the individual can struggle while the team still achieves results. I think that?s how you develop players like Tonali... there isn?t as much pressure on him as there would be if we were mid table and fighting for our lives. Instead, he comes into a great group and has the chance to grow.

[mumbojumbo]

Originally Posted by Milan10

We don?t have proper depth for our 2 man midfield, so I can assure you we won?t be switching to a 3 man midfield anytime soon... our only substitute for the entire midfield would be Krunic, man.

This system is awesome, I?m not sure why anyone would want to change. It works when we are missing our best players, it is aesthetically pleasing, we?ve lost a single match in 30 using it... And we are 5 points clear in Serie A.

Just keep adding young, talented players like we did last summer with Diaz, Tonali, Hawg, and Dalot. We are on a crazy upward trajectory and just need to keep adding pieces.

Let's just ignore any post suggesting trying different formations. These people are insane. Even at the current formation, we need Tonali to gel in and still generating results. People are thinking of changing formations. What kind of joke is that.

Anyway Pioli changed formations a few times like 442 in game before

[Pingu]

Originally Posted by Australiano1980

We need to form a team, the youngests can long a decade here, we gonna let them playing in a tactics that suits wingers only?
I mean.. atleast a Xmas tree.

Tonali, Bennacer and Kessie eventually will be playing together, let it be now that we have an advantage in the table.

Or how about we don't. Instead, use the system as I said that is currently working and excelling, allows us to play at our strengths without key players as nonsonoqui said.

Tonali, Bennacer, Kessie are three younger players with great talent and ceiling. Doesn't mean they need to play together. How about we focus on winning and building a squad competing at the top - which requires top class talent on the bench, who will all get a fair share of minutes.

[ChinaMilan]

Originally Posted by nonsonoqui

The problem is you take the dimmest view of the situation and present it as penetrating insight. It?s the oldest trick in the book and several have done it on this forum before you.

The other problem is you are too hung up on individuals when assessing our depth. I instead see a fluid system that allows mistakes and offsets the growth period for players. Yes, like Tonali, whom you hate but who is improving steadily.

I privilege the way we interpret how to play over assessing individual quality for this young Milan at least. I do that for a variety of reasons, the main one being that we have limited resources and despite that we have won our games without key players. We shuffle things around and make it work. This allows me not to get hung up on Krunic screwing up, for example. And this flexibility is our depth; not whether Krunic is an able replacement. I have adjusted my expectations. When we are rich, I will tweak them again.

I agree with you about the system, we have a very stong system that takes off the pressure of the younest and allow them to develop, however i disagree with you about individual quality and how it is not important when served within the system, as you can make mistakes against teams like celtic and the system will fix that, however we saw what happened against lille first round, and from january onwards most of our games will be in such important, and with much tougher opponent, so if you dont have a bench which is as good as the starters we shouldnt expect much in terms of results on the long term as we are not lucky with injuries as it seems.

Also as someone pointed, it should be much easier to play in a funtioning system while the whole team is winning and helping you to grow, and with no pressure, and they dont count on you, however if you cant really perform in this environment then i dont expect them to perform when you need them to thats my point.

I know we dont have the money to have messi on the bench, however we should be realistic about hyping player like tonali who is a dm that cant cant defend, disteibute the play or even positioning himself as what a dm should.

[KujaIX]

I honestly don't get people who want to change a formation which has worked for our best period of results in decades just because.

It makes absolutely no sense to me.

[Australiano1980]

Originally Posted by Pingu

Or how about we don't. Instead, use the system as I said that is currently working and excelling, allows us to play at our strengths without key players as nonsonoqui said.

Tonali, Bennacer, Kessie are three younger players with great talent and ceiling. Doesn't mean they need to play together. How about we focus on winning and building a squad competing at the top - which requires top class talent on the bench, who will all get a fair share of minutes.

Im thinking in long terms. The way it is now its been great, but it wont last long, Ibra is 40 and Pioli was never on Maldini's list for obvious reasons. He can?t keep this team up for too long.

We probably gonna go back to Pre Ibra era.. we have talented players in the middle, we should built from it.

Originally Posted by Milan10

We don?t have proper depth for our 2 man midfield, so I can assure you we won?t be switching to a 3 man midfield anytime soon... our only substitute for theentire midfield would be Krunic, man.

This system is awesome, I?m not sure why anyone would want to change. It works when we are missing our best players, it is aesthetically pleasing, we?ve lost a single match in 30 using it... And we are 5 points clear in Serie A.

Just keep adding young, talented players like we did last summer with Diaz, Tonali, Hawg, and Dalot. We are on a crazy upward trajectory and just need to keep adding pieces.

Hakan and Diaz could play that part too if need it.. Diaz is good but he has a confusing football style.

[Milan10]

Originally Posted by KujaIX

I honestly don't get people who want to change a formation which has worked for our best period of results in decades just because.

It makes absolutely no sense to me.

It?s insane when you consider that this current squad is performing as well as or better in Serie A than some of our most legendary teams. The squad is breaking records set by Capello and Ancelotti?s Milan. Things are great and should get better with more years of investment. The biggest question mark now is whether or not it can be sustained when Ibrahimovic retires. Hopefully, signing Halaand will settle that question

Management is building a really good, deep squad. You can?t have complete depth right away, and frankly adding slowly to the team is better than the type of failed overhaul we experienced under Fassobelli. You build and add piece by piece market by market. We added incredible depth to the attack with Hawg and Diaz and brought in a future superstar vice-Bennacer this summer...

In the next two markets, I expect more of the same... Add a talented, young vice-Kessie... add a talented, young CB to replace Musacchio and serve as our 3rd or 4th CB. You just build depth position by position over time and all the while we are investing in youths to hopefully bring through the system and replace players as they leave.

[Milan10]

Originally Posted by Australiano1980

Im thinking in long terms. The way it is now its been great, but it wont last long, Ibra is 40 and Pioli was never on Maldini's list for obvious reasons. He can?t keep this team up for too long.

We probably gonna go back to Pre Ibra era.. we have talented players in the middle, we should built from it.




Hakan and Diaz could play that part too if need it.. Diaz is good but he has a confusing football style.

I would respectfully disagree. Why would things get worse? We have very talented and young players gaining an incredible amount of experience early in their careers... I don?t think we have seen the prime of Kessie, Bennacer, Theo, Calabria, Donnarumma, Hawg, Leao, Tonali and so on... Hell, even Romagnoli isn?t near his prime yet and I was one of the people he was telling to stfu for criticizing him. Gabbia... you get the point.

Ibra was vital when he came because our morale was at an all time low and there was no leader in the squad. He lifted the spirit of the club and most importantly I think taught others how to lead by example. The same can be said of Kjaer... Kessie has become a leader, they call him il presidents for goodness sake. The squad is developing on and off the pitch, the impact Ibra has had will be felt even after he leaves, or hopefully joins our staff in some capacity. His production will need to be replaced, and hopefully it will be with a truly world class player as we will be in a much better position by the time he is ready to hang up his boots.

That is what is so exciting about this squad... I truly believe its best days are ahead of it.

[nonsonoqui]

Originally Posted by ChinaMilan

I agree with you about the system, we have a very stong system that takes off the pressure of the younest and allow them to develop, however i disagree with you about individual quality and how it is not important when served within the system, as you can make mistakes against teams like celtic and the system will fix that, however we saw what happened against lille first round, and from january onwards most of our games will be in such important, and with much tougher opponent, so if you dont have a bench which is as good as the starters we shouldnt expect much in terms of results on the long term as we are not lucky with injuries as it seems.

Also as someone pointed, it should be much easier to play in a funtioning system while the whole team is winning and helping you to grow, and with no pressure, and they dont count on you, however if you cant really perform in this environment then i dont expect them to perform when you need them to thats my point.

I know we dont have the money to have messi on the bench, however we should be realistic about hyping player like tonali who is a dm that cant cant defend, disteibute the play or even positioning himself as what a dm should.

You?re too harsh on Tonali this early.

Either we?re a team that nurtures young talent, so they can express their potential, or we are not. And if we?re, then we have to tolerate mistakes.

It?s too early to comment on anyone?s quality so far. In previous dysfunctional Milan teams we made the mistake of rejecting players too quickly. I am okay with mistakes as long as we minimize and learn from them.

In the meantime, we have an environment and system that gives us another route to having depth. It?s the difference between having two good defenders and having a good defence.

So, no, I am not ready to write off Dalot and Tonali yet.

[leaf]

Originally Posted by nonsonoqui

You?re too harsh on Tonali this early.

Either we?re a team that nurtures young talent, so they can express their potential, or we are not. And if we?re, then we have to tolerate mistakes.

Its too early to comment on anyones quality so far. In previous dysfunctional Milan teams we made the mistake of rejecting players too quickly. I am okay with mistakes as long as we minimize and learn from them.

In the meantime, we have an environment and system that gives us another route to having depth. It?s the difference between having two good defenders and having a good defence.

So, no, I am not ready to write off Dalot and Tonali yet.

Someone hook this guy up with two Brazilian hookers pls.
Yes that means you Pingu.

[hakim]

Full match link anyone?

[Cloren]

Didn’t we lose to Lille using the 4-3-3 formation?

Why would anyone want us to change from a successful 4-2-3-1 formation to another one is beyond me, we’ve been having our best results for freaking decade. We would be nuts to do that.

[ChinaMilan]

Originally Posted by nonsonoqui

You?re too harsh on Tonali this early.

Either we?re a team that nurtures young talent, so they can express their potential, or we are not. And if we?re, then we have to tolerate mistakes.

It?s too early to comment on anyone?s quality so far. In previous dysfunctional Milan teams we made the mistake of rejecting players too quickly. I am okay with mistakes as long as we minimize and learn from them.

In the meantime, we have an environment and system that gives us another route to having depth. It?s the difference between having two good defenders and having a good defence.

So, no, I am not ready to write off Dalot and Tonali yet.

You have a point, and im really hoping im wrong about our bench strength, and that wont hurt us on the long run, however i do believe the players who would fail to impress during the year should be sent back to thier clubs or be sold.

Only time will tell.

[Sognatore]

Originally Posted by hakim

Full match link anyone?

First half
https://mega.nz/file/oxcAhJRJ#xFG85T...qm7Cw1NPOnhl48

Second half
https://mega.nz/file/wtcCWBDD#zLqhZd...c83NJ8NuZ5sgdA

Bookmark these two pages. They usually release full matches within a couple of hours

www.fullmatchesandshows.com
www.hdmatches.net

[Australiano1980]

Originally Posted by Milan10

I would respectfully disagree. Why would things get worse? We have very talented and young players gaining an incredible amount of experience early in their careers... I don?t think we have seen the prime of Kessie, Bennacer, Theo, Calabria, Donnarumma, Hawg, Leao, Tonali and so on... Hell, even Romagnoli isn?t near his prime yet and I was one of the people he was telling to stfu for criticizing him. Gabbia... you get the point.

Ibra was vital when he came because our morale was at an all time low and there was no leader in the squad. He lifted the spirit of the club and most importantly I think taught others how to lead by example. The same can be said of Kjaer... Kessie has become a leader, they call him il presidents for goodness sake. The squad is developing on and off the pitch, the impact Ibra has had will be felt even after he leaves, or hopefully joins our staff in some capacity. His production will need to be replaced, and hopefully it will be with a truly world class player as we will be in a much better position by the time he is ready to hang up his boots.

That is what is so exciting about this squad... I truly believe its best days are ahead of it.

Like i said, the 'UP' of this squad was duo Ibra's arriving. We need to start working thinking outside of this scenario or will be 2012 all over again.
We cant waste the quality of this squad.