Semi-finals: The Netherlands 0-0 Argentina (PK: 2-4) Wednesday 09/07/2014 22:00 CEST

[Ash]

well 1 so called "young talent" was capocannoniere last season. sorry to break the bad news.

proves nothing so far

Dominic Adiyah was the best player once in the U-20 World Cup

Where is he now?

The fact is the youngsters from a host of other countries have shown far more at the biggest/senior stage than the ones from Italy have

I mean, the only one of note who has come through so far is Verratti

 

[milanicious]

Worst WC ever

 

[Rickaka]

I don't disagree with you one bit on any of this. (btw, Memphis really works way better as a super sub than starter IMO, he becomes more of a surprise factor when playing against tired defenses).

And I do think Van Gaal is ballsy, and a great coach inspite of me trolling a bit on it (just feel everything he's doing is being overblown, and mostly because he will coach of ManUtd, what Holland did vs Brazil in the last WC deserved a bigger blow fest than OMG HE CHANGED GKS!!!!!!!!!!).

But lets be honest, that was your attacking tactic since the game vs Chile onwards was pretty one dimensional, and while Robben has done really great, and can change the game with one good chance...the rest was too predictable (and I believe you can ask for more since your problem is more in the back, you have a fine attacking lineup).

Oh I fully agree on the EPL fanboys that overhype anything related to their league, but LVG is just a really great and unique coach who gets results almost everywhere he goes.

Above all he makes logic and rational decisions. Cilessen never stopped a pen, Krul is a better penalty stopper, you sub him on for pk's. And you can see it worked as Krul stopped 2 and Cilessen didn't save any despite reaching the right way.

Robben, Fer, Memphis, RvP, Fer, Sneijder, de Vrij. That's 7 goal scorers. Also literally every player in the squad(minus the 3rd gk) got minutes which really contributed to the team spirit and belief in sucess. So to say it was an one man success is unfair imo.

Besides Robben is at his disposal and in the form of his life. Why not mold your setup and gameplan to fit arguably the best player of the tournament?

 

[Gio]

Yeah but 3 euros to 1 italy, more semis and final appearences as well

Yeah alright, I concede that. Doesn't mean Italy should be shit on so constantly though. I understand the dislike for Juve players, I feel it also, but it's weird to want to see a nation fail that includes Milan (an Italian club)'s Italian players fail.

 

[Sven]

I'm impressed by Argentina. Solid defensive unit, compact team. Kinda reminds me of the Estudiantes team. A sign that Sabella is working his hand.

Germany still favorites, but I wont put my money on it.

 

[Tantalis]

they are shite indeed, winning 1934, 1938 wc when everybody busy with the war

what war.... Nazi Germany may have seized Austria and Czechoslovakia in early 1938 but war, and other countries were not involved until 1939...

 

[vB9]

Germany still favorites, but I wont put my money on it.

Totally! I fear Germany.

 

[Patri]

The game ended 1-1...Italy won on Penalties
So no...Italy could not have won without Materazzi
Materazzi scored the only goal for Italy and he was the one responsible for taking out the opposition's best player.
I don't even care who won that WC...but lay off the fucking crack ffs and face the fact that Italy was the most undeserved WC winner in history and that they didn't even deserve to be in the final in the first place
Just admit that it was luck

So you are saying that a team would not have won a game if the team's most influential player in that game had not played. Hmmm.. Interesting.

 

[milanoldfarts]

Just how old are you aha. Oh and where are you from?

19...and I'm not a biased Italian or even a FIF(Fake Italian Fan) like many here
I'm a Milan fan...and Italy has always been more like Juventus/Inter than Milan to me so I don't care for them much

Spain in 2010 is the same as Italy in 2006 too and as Argentina will probably be now in 2014
I'm tired of seeing shit teams win the world cup...I'm probably going to skip the next WC entirely...fuck this shit...Milan's not even in it so why should I care?

 

[williamp]

I'm impressed by Argentina. Solid defensive unit, compact team. Kinda reminds me of the Estudiantes team. A sign that Sabella is working his hand.

Germany still favorites, but I wont put my money on it.

Solid defense = passing the ball between the same four players with almost zero intent to attack?

 

[Casualista]

proves nothing so far

Dominic Adiyah was the best player once in the U-20 World Cup

Where is he now?

The fact is the youngsters from a host of other countries have shown far more at the biggest/senior stage than the ones from Italy have

I mean, the only one of note who has come through so far is Verratti

Yup. I guess a few more group stage exits are needed to get that lesson across.

Italian youth is rubbish thats why old guards like pirlo, de rossi, barzaglie, chiellini, buffon, motta keep getting called over and over again. And why wouldnt they?

When their replacements are : rannochia, bonucci, sirigu, marchisio, poli, and all the fodder from parma and atalanta.

There is a reason why the last italian to see a ucl final is materazzi... As a sub for 5 minute...

Italian youth: neither rated nor bought by european elites. Other than veratti (and immobile.)

 

[Gio]

19...and I'm not a biased Italian or even a FIF(Fake Italian Fan) like many here
I'm a Milan fan...and Italy has always been more like Juventus/Inter than Milan to me so I don't care for them much

Spain in 2010 is the same as Italy in 2006 too and as Argentina will probably be now in 2014
I'm tired of seeing shit teams win the world cup...I'm probably going to skip the next WC entirely...fuck this shit...Milan's not even in it so why should I care?

You didn't answer where you're from? I've been brought up supporting Italy and scotland, so I guess have a similar dislike for the england national team. I still think Italy have had enough top-level Milan players in their most positive moments that they shouldn't be disliked so vehemently. I find it odd in all honesty.

 

[vB9]

I'm a Milan fan...and Italy has always been more like Juventus/Inter than Milan to me so I

In the great times... Defence was provided by Milan.

 

[Senatore_M84]

wait you're 19 and you claim milan play good football?

They haven't played 'good football' (whatever that is, but i'll entertain you and say attack minded champaigne bs) since 2005 really. It's been pragmatic since then. not that i mind but facts.

So you were like 10? Yeah....

 

[Casualista]

Yeah alright, I concede that. Doesn't mean Italy should be shit on so constantly though. I understand the dislike for Juve players, I feel it also, but it's weird to want to see a nation fail that includes Milan (an Italian club)'s Italian players fail.

Good thing milan dont have to stick with italian players right?

They can move on and look at other european countries and south america. Milan's fate, justlike inter's was doesnt need to be tied with italy's.

Even juve realize this and are moving away. Their starting line up has less and less italians.

 

[Sven]

Solid defense = passing the ball between the same four players with almost zero intent to attack?

Yeah, that and not giving almost any scoring chance to a great Holland team

 

[Ash]

Dont get me wrong

I have high hopes for some (especially the ones from Milan such as De Sciglio, ELS, Cristante, Fossatti, heck even Balo)

But so far, Italian youth have proven very little at the big stage

 

[williamp]

Yeah, that and not giving almost any scoring chance to a great Holland team

This is hardly a GREAT Holland team. Besides Sneijder, Robben and De Jong the rest of the team is average/good at best.

 

[Gio]

Good thing milan dont have to stick with italian players right?

They can move on and look at other european countries and south america. Milan's fate, justlike inter's was doesnt need to be tied with italy's.

Even juve realize this and are moving away. Their starting line up has less and less italians.

Tbh again as with my response to M.O.F., in Milan's greatest moments, Italians were at the core. But that is history I guess, the future does not look good except for the odd one or two. There is no strong core. Hell, I don't think any country has ever had a good 10-15 years of constant superiority over any other in terms of talented players, like Italy did from the 90s to mid 00s with defenders, and because there were so many great defenders in this era, fans of Italian clubs became used to it, therefore anything else is seen as failure.

 

[Senatore_M84]

fair point

But in terms of talent level they really didnt face a squad that was far superior to them other than Spain (in terms of individual players)

Argentina were more or less in par. They both had weaknesses and strengths in the same areas

Chile and Mexico barely had anymore standout players than them other than Sanchez, Vidal and Hernandez

This is of course all based on pre-tournament (which is what Im assuming people are talking about). Post tournament performances are a different matter

i mean i think it's fair to say aside from germany and spain, everyone else has talent w/ flaws.

Dutch are STACKED up-top and have some solid CMs but i'm not exactly impressed bu their D.

Brazil have some class players but holes. And on and on.

so it's pretty hard to define big sides v. small. There are those two who are really deep. Another 4-5 in next teir (which i'd include italy, dutch, argentina), then another 8-10 really good sides (like mexico, chile, colombia who have some real good players but still a bit more lack)

iunno it's hard to rank really

 

[Senatore_M84]

This is hardly a GREAT Holland team. Besides Sneijder, Robben and De Jong the rest of the team is average/good at best.

so not allowing dutch strength to exploit your weakness is bad?

yup. Just stop

 

[williamp]

so not allowing dutch strength to exploit your weakness is bad?

yup. Just stop

Argentinas weakness is in attack

 

[milanoldfarts]

I still think Italy have had enough top-level Milan players in their most positive moments that they shouldn't be disliked so vehemently. I find it odd in all honesty.

I didn't dislike Italy in 2006(neither did I like them that much)...but they didn't deserve to win it lol

I don't really like Italy nowadays because tbh the current team is not exciting
At least a decade ago or so Nesta,Maldini,Gattuso,Pippo were in the team so at least it had some players I liked

But the way Italy plays has never been like Milan so I never became a fan of them when I was a kid(like I assume many Milan Fans became Italy Fans simply cuz Milan was an Italian Team)

The only time I really hated Italy was 2012 with that prick Pirlo and everyone overrating them(I was happy when Spain brought the Pirlo Fanboys back to earth ...though I hate Spain too but I hate Pirlo even more)
Thank god Pirlo retired now I can watch Italy without puking

 

[Senatore_M84]

I didn't dislike Italy in 2006(neither did I like them that much)...but they didn't deserve to win it lol

I don't really like Italy nowadays because tbh the current team is not exciting
At least a decade ago or so Nesta,Maldini,Gattuso,Pippo were in the team so at least it had some players I liked

But the way Italy plays has never been like Milan so I never became a fan of them when I was a kid(like I assume many Milan Fans became Italy Fans simply cuz Milan was an Italian Team)

The only time I really hated Italy was 2012 with that prick Pirlo and everyone overrating them(I was happy when Spain brought the Pirlo Fanboys back to earth ...though I hate Spain too but I hate Pirlo even more)
Thank god Pirlo retired now I can watch Italy without puking

the IRONY of a guy liking milan for goot football and calling pirlo a prick

Anyone who actually watched last true entertaining milan sides knows Pirlo was the reason it was. He made entire team tick. sure sheva, and others were stars, but it played w/ a style cause of pirlo

 

[Sven]

This is hardly a GREAT Holland team. Besides Sneijder, Robben and De Jong the rest of the team is average/good at best.

Enough for a WC semifinal?

Argentina took the right approach. Cautious and compact. Didn't give a chance to Holland use the best weapon - counter

 

[Senatore_M84]

Argentinas weakness is in attack

seriously? Argentina holding ball keeps their WEAK defense from being exposed and keeps dutch strength (attack) from not doing so

 

[Ash]

If any team has won the WC it is because they deserved to win it.

Unless they had won it under shady circumstances, saying otherwise is just ones's own fuckin' opinion

p.s. - Italy deserved to win the WC. Zidane didnt need to headbutt Materazzi (regardless of what he said). Players shit talk in the pitch all the time. But a headbutt is a RED by the book

 

[Casualista]

Tbh again as with my response to M.O.F., in Milan's greatest moments, Italians were at the core. But that is history I guess, the future does not look good except for the odd one or two. There is no strong core. Hell, I don't think any country has ever had a good 10-15 years of constant superiority over any other in terms of talented players, like Italy did from the 90s to mid 00s with defenders, and because there were so many great defenders in this era, fans of Italian clubs became used to it, therefore anything else is seen as failure.

Maybe they didnt have an edge per say on talent over countries consistently but they could always put out a very respectable 11. I can remember all the t names in 60s mazzolas and riveras, the gentiles, fachettis, and scireas in 70s and 80s, the donadonis, baresis, maldinis etc in 90s, pirlos, tottis and gattusos in 2000s..... And now to the balotelli, rannochia, and parolos....

You can clearly see the talent glut. Better milan find a new identity like all the other big teams.

 

[milanoldfarts]

In the great times... Defence was provided by Milan.

I know that...that was when Italy was still kind of decent
But the way Italy has always played was always closer to Catenaccio than Milan that's what I meant

 

[williamp]

Enough for a WC semifinal?

Argentina took the right approach. Cautious and compact. Didn't give a chance to Holland use the best weapon - counter

It's no secret that Holland overachieved a round too far similar to Brazil.