The Rumour Commode XXXIX: A Cardinal Sin

[Curupira]

Fuck it, if Paul thinks that's best let's do it.

Zaniolo revives his career and we revive our season would be a beautiful story.

 

[omer486]

Listen, if Roma is in a good place financially, they wouldn't be in this whole shit show with Zaniolo (not being able to sell him unless its obligation due to FFP) And Napoli is padded by their sales, pretty much.

I get your point though, just a little bit more of wise spending would net so much more return.

Napoli sold Koulibaly for 38 mil and Fabian Ruiz for 23 mil. So they increased their revenues by 61 mil with these sales. They signed Raspadori for 35 mil ( 5 mil loan, 30 mil obligation ) , Kim 18 mil ,Anguisa 15 mil, Mathías Olivera 11 mil, Kvara 10 mil, Ostigard 5 mil, Simeone ( 5 mil loan fee), Ndombele (0.5 mil loan fee ).

So they spent around 100 mill on transfers. Besides Koulibaly and Ruiz they also did some smaller sales totalling around 20 mil. So basically around a 20 mil net mercato (100 mil buys minus 80 mil sales ). People aren't counting Raspadori full price because it's a loan but since its with obligation you have to count it like a regular purchase.

Milan did a 35 mil net mercato and just increased shirt sponsorship by around 50 mil!. And Milan overall has lower salaries than Napoli.

And a deal like Kavara you get once in many, many years!

People think that Napoli is running on big profit, self funding their club. That's not accurate. Their are spending good amounts now and in the past ( Osimhen, Lozano, Manolas, Milik.....)

 

[MilanMB]

I strongly disagree and I think the majority too. I'm not going to pull the "we won Scudetto" card again. But these players were first or second in the table for more than two years. Two years. Not two months or two weeks. Two years! That's way too much of a sample size to get dismantled by a couple of super bad weeks.

So yeah, I strongly disagree that now all of a sudden we find out that these guys in reality aren't even good enough to beat Lecce or Sassuolo at home. Or to get three goals from an Inter side that looses to Monza and struggles against Cremonese. I know that that's not what you're saying. But blaming these last few weeks mainly to the quality of the squad means being way too nice to Piolis fuck ups.

There were early signs this whole season that something was off compared to before. I blamed them mainly to injuries combined with fatigue because of the compressed schedule. Yet despite everything the squad still was good enough to claim the 2nd spot in the table and show some impressive displays throughout the year. I mean I was there in San Siro when we beat the shit out of Salzburg only days before the world cup. That team ran. That team fighted. That team had a solidity and self awareness we can only dream of right now.

For me the main culprit for our current situation is definitely Pioli. IMO he completely failed to read the moment of the team, especially after the Lecce game where we were 2:0 down but could have easily be 4:0 down at halftime and where we didn't manage to create shit once we equalized in the 2nd half. When he should have changed, he didn't and made things worse. Now we've reached a point where our solidity and mental strength is shattered. I'm not sure that tactical adjustment will fix it. I actually believe we're at a point where it's already too late, and that was completely avoidable if Pioli didn't take Inter, Lazio and Sassuolo to realize it.

And while typing all of that I haven't even begun to touch in his abysmal physical preparations with the team. No team on earth has the depth to sustain what we have to sustain year after year with Piolis butcher team. Not even Liverpool, Tottenham or Chelsea to name many star stacked teams with ten times our Mercato budget but yet brutally destroyed in the league when missing a couple of starters.

For the sake to not extend this to a biblical wall of text I'll stop here. Because yeah, Pioli surely isn't the only culprit. The management has his fair share. Then there are unexplainable individual fuckups and abysmal goalkeepers making things even worse. All agreed. But Pioli defenitly has contributed the most to this current nightmare.

This is a really long post bro

I just saw "I strongly disagree" and when people say that to me they're usually wrong.

 

[Kojak]

35 mil net spend! They sold Hauge for around 12-14 mil.

But what method to keep them accountable? Fire them and hire new sports management or just keep them and refuse to let them spend or something else? What's going to help the club in the winning and in gaining value?

Btw, Napoli's yearly squad cost which includes the amortization of transfers plus yearly salaries is higher than Milan's. So they are spending more overall. If the owners let management give 6 mil salary to Kessie and 3-3.5 mil to Romagnoli, then there is no reason to buy Vranckx and Thiaw.

Napoli overall mercato was much better, but overall they are spending good amounts on their squad.

Lol 35m net spend is still SIGNIFICANTLY more than any of our rivals e.g. according to Transfermarkt, Napoli 13m net surplus, Roma 43m net surplus, Inter 16m net spend etc. Also, all of the aforementioned clubs sold/released some of their best players last summer whereas Paolo wasn't required to sell anybody so stop whining!

Anyway, like I said before, Gerry is obviously unimpressed with the fact that Maldini blew c.50m on a number of players who've failed to make an impact in addition to handing out long term deals to injury prone players like Origi + Florenzi. Therefore, he's being prudent with his money and waiting until summer before making additional funds available which is perfectly reasonable. However, I also expect him to ask Paolo to correct his mistakes and sell some of the deadwood and potentially a key player if we miss out on the CL to balance the books.

As for Napoli, according to Capology, their annual payroll is significantly cheaper than ours (70m vs. 88m). Anyway, I don't know how reliable these figures are but I'd genuinely be surprised if their salaries and amortization costs are higher given that they sold/released most of their biggest earners last summer e.g. Koulibaly, Mertens + Insigne and replaced them with low cost players from minor leagues likes like Kim + Kvaradonna.

2023-2024 Napoli Salaries and Contracts

Capology | Football Salaries & Finances

www.capology.com

2023-2024 AC Milan Salaries and Contracts

Capology | Football Salaries & Finances

www.capology.com

 

[Master Smurf]

And my spirit will leave my body if I have to witness Grintuso football again.

Oh....you rather the assblastings of January 2023

Jokes aside - Rino could only be caretaker if they are desperate and then they find a long-term coach they plan to back

 

[Curupira]

Napoli sold Koulibaly for 38 mil and Fabian Ruiz for 23 mil. So they increased their revenues by 61 mil. They signed Raspadori for 35 mil ( 5 mil loan, 30 mil obligation ) , Kim 18 mil ,Anuisa 15 mil, Mathías Olivera 11 mil, Kvara 10 mil, Ostigard 5 mil, Simeone ( 5 mil loan fee), Ndombele (0.5 mil loan fee ).

So they spent around 100 mill on transfers. Besides Koulibaly and Ruiz they also did some smaller sales totalling around 20 mil. So basically around a 20 mil net mercato (100 mil buys minus 80 mil sales ). People aren't counting Raspadori full price because it's a loan but since its with obligation you have to count it like a regular purchase.

Milan did a 35 mil net mercato and just increased shirt sponsorship by around 50 mil!. And Milan overall has lower salaries than Napoli.

And a deal like Kavara you get once in many, many years!

People think that Napoli is running on big profit, self funding their club. That's not accurate. Their are spending good amounts now and in the past ( Osimhen, Lozano, Manolas, Milik.....)

And in the past, they've also made sales like Higuain, Jorginho, Allan.

We are in agreement that our owner is way to risk averse, but Napoli definitely sell a lot better than we do which is why they have more room to play with.

 

[actrader10]

I cannot believe he has not been sacked today or even rumoured to be.

Meanwhile jerry gives fuck all. The guy is the worse owner i have ever seen. At least say something.

 

[Samaldinho]

I never said it's the objective right thing to do, "Paul" gets a say on this right?

"Paul" obviously isn't exerting enough pressure on Stefen to make these changes. These are changes that Stefen is CAPABLE of. Unlike setting up an offensive pattern so we can have other less predictable build up, my data is that we haven't been able to do this since he got here.

So if these changes are so painfully obvious, why is "Paul" not seeing it and forcing Stefen to make them.

You're changing the subject from Pioli to Maldini. How do you even know what level of say Maldini has (or even wants) on the day-to-day or even tactical choices of Pioli?

Why didn't Billy Beane force his manager into dropping Pena? He had to take him away. Did that mean he was a weak GM because of his inability to force the manager to play the team as constructed?

I just find the consensus around Pioli "getting it right" with Adli and Tata's respective positions to be quite jarring when compared to how much shit Pioli gets for literally everything else.

 

[Curupira]

You're changing the subject from Pioli to Maldini. How do you even know what level of say Maldini has (or even wants) on the day-to-day or even tactical choices of Pioli?

Why didn't Billy Beane force his manager into dropping Pena? He had to take him away. Did that mean he was a weak GM because of his inability to force the manager to play the team as constructed?

I just find the consensus around Pioli "getting it right" with Adli and Tata's respective positions to be quite jarring when compared to how much shit Pioli gets for literally everything else.

Where did I say he got it right with Adli and Tata?


I've said that all of Pioli's behaviors are in alignment with those of a manager who's at the end of his wits. Relying on things he consider best chances for him to succeed (starting Giroud despite him being ill-fitted for our press strategy, going with Tata instead of Mirante or new guy).

 

[omer486]

And in the past, they've also made sales like Higuain, Jorginho, Allan.

We are in agreement that our owner is way to risk averse, but Napoli definitely sell a lot better than we do which is why they have more room to play with.

Milan should sell better for sure. Kessie and Donnarumma should have been sold earlier. At the same time Milan is bigger club historically and with a bigger fan base than Napoli. It's like Real and Atletico Madrid. MIlan has a lot more room to increase their revenues if they are run well and with a bit more of smart spending.

 

[Curupira]

Milan should sell better for sure. Kessie and Donnarumma should have been sold earlier. At the same time Milan is bigger club historically and with a bigger fan base than Napoli. It's like Real and Atletico Madrid. MIlan has a lot more room to increase their revenues if they are run well and with a bit more of smart spending.

100%. Or at the very least, you'd want to see us be able to match what Napoli is doing in the market, which is more than reasonable to ask for.

And I hope they learn to start selling better with Leao.

 

[taura]

well somebody is gonna sit in the stands for the next 6 months

#SerieA | @OfficialASRoma , #Zaniolo excluded from the technical project

 

[Samaldinho]

Fuck it, if Paul thinks that's best let's do it.

Zaniolo revives his career and we revive our season would be a beautiful story.

Watch Zaniolo is that missing piece to unlock Pioli's vision lol.

Where did I say he got it right with Adli and Tata?

I've said that all of Pioli's behaviors are in alignment with those of a manager who's at the end of his wits. Relying on things he consider best chances for him to succeed (starting Giroud despite him being ill-fitted for our press strategy, going with Tata instead of Mirante or new guy).

I misunderstood and thought it was implied that you thought that. My bad. I think other voices have, especially on the Adli point, underlined that Pioli was correct in not giving him time, which makes no sense to me.

I agree, Pioli is in full panic, but he's doing it in a weird way, by going all-out attack. GP had his 4312 and then switched back to Gattuso's 433 the second he got into trouble, but he was misusing every player possible. Hakan CDM, Suso CAM, Borini RCM, Samu SS? It was... horrific. But at least GP went safe when he was in a bad spot. I'm sure all of us would have rather had two draws instead of two losses the last two rounds.

 

[omer486]

You're changing the subject from Pioli to Maldini. How do you even know what level of say Maldini has (or even wants) on the day-to-day or even tactical choices of Pioli?

Why didn't Billy Beane force his manager into dropping Pena? He had to take him away. Did that mean he was a weak GM because of his inability to force the manager to play the team as constructed?

I just find the consensus around Pioli "getting it right" with Adli and Tata's respective positions to be quite jarring when compared to how much shit Pioli gets for literally everything else.

Before Adli came to Milan, I thought he looked quite talented. But then I gave Pioli the benefit of the doubt. But now I'm not that sure of it ( Pioli ) anymore!!

Thiaw and Vranckx were signed as gap fillers ( 10 mil money left to spend and 2 positions to fill ), so if there is a lower chance they make it. Adli wasn't signed as a gap filler because you sign gap fillers to fill an immediate gap in the squad, you don't sign them to keep them on loan. Adli seems a player the management carefully scouted and believed in...

 

[Curupira]

Watch Zaniolo is that missing piece to unlock Pioli's vision lol.


I misunderstood and thought it was implied that you thought that. My bad. I think other voices have, especially on the Adli point, underlined that Pioli was correct in not giving him time, which makes no sense to me.

I agree, Pioli is in full panic, but he's doing it in a weird way, by going all-out attack. GP had his 4312 and then switched back to Gattuso's 433 the second he got into trouble, but he was misusing every player possible. Hakan CDM, Suso CAM, Borini RCM, Samu SS? It was... horrific. But at least GP went safe when he was in a bad spot. I'm sure all of us would have rather had two draws instead of two losses the last two rounds.

Bro, GP was a visionary. misunderstood genius, something like our own necromancer

Look at Kebab now

 

[Samaldinho]

Oh....you rather the assblastings of January 2023

I laughed at this because I thought of this being in some history textbook in 2467, the professor adjusting his glasses before going: "Ah, yes, The Assblastings of 2023..."

 

[AC_Wesley]

Getting cancer and recovering and retuning to starting 11 (haller) is apparantly alot faster then our gk recovering from foot injury

 

[Hitchens]

Zaniolo turning down 5.5m a year and willing to train in his apartment for 6 months in order to join Milan.

 

[MilanBG]

Valencia sacked Gattuso. Every serious club is doing these changes, but not us.
-Worst title defense in the history
-Humiliating exit from Coppa
-Trashed by merda in the Super Cup
-Completely outplayed by Lecce
-Humiliating loss against Lazio
-Biggest home defeat in the last 30 years against the 17th team in the ranking
-Worst defense in the top 5 leagues in 2023 - 98th place out of 98 teams
-Awful gameplay
-Constant injuries and terrible management on the physical condition of the players

Not enough for sacking apparently

 

[Jivara]

If were gonna still act like peasants next summer then try the following:

Zaniolo for free
Kessie or Amrabat for whatever cost (25m I guess)
Get experienced CB, Smalling for free perhaps
Get a proper striker for 30m

 

[BaniCPT]

Valencia sacked Gattuso. Every serious club is doing these changes, but not us.
-Worst title defense in the history
-Humiliating exit from Coppa
-Trashed by merda in the Super Cup
-Completely outplayed by Lecce
-Humiliating loss against Lazio
-Biggest home defeat in the last 30 years against the 17th team in the ranking
-Worst defense in the top 5 leagues in 2023 - 98th place out of 98 teams
-Awful gameplay
-Constant injuries and terrible management on the physical condition of the players

Not enough for sacking apparently

Friendlies, all lost. And 3-0 loss to PSV of freaking Dutch eredivisie

 

[omer486]

Lol 35m net spend is still SIGNIFICANTLY more than any of our rivals e.g. according to Transfermarkt, Napoli 13m net surplus, Roma 43m net surplus, Inter 16m net spend etc. Also, all of the aforementioned clubs sold/released some of their best players last summer whereas Paolo wasn't required to sell anybody so stop whining!

Anyway, like I said before, Gerry is obviously unimpressed with the fact that Maldini blew c.50m on a number of players who've failed to make an impact in addition to handing out long term deals to injury prone players like Origi + Florenzi. Therefore, he's being prudent with his money and waiting until summer before making additional funds available which is perfectly reasonable. However, I also expect him to ask Paolo to correct his mistakes and sell some of the deadwood and potentially a key player if we miss out on the CL to balance the books.

As for Napoli, according to Capology, their annual payroll is significantly cheaper than ours (70m vs. 88m). Anyway, I don't know how reliable these figures are but I'd genuinely be surprised if their salaries and amortization costs are higher given that they sold/released most of their biggest earners last summer e.g. Koulibaly, Mertens + Insigne and replaced them with low cost players from minor leagues likes like Kim + Kvaradonna.

2023-2024 Napoli Salaries and Contracts

Capology | Football Salaries & Finances

www.capology.com

2023-2024 AC Milan Salaries and Contracts

Capology | Football Salaries & Finances

www.capology.com

Transfermarket only list the 5 mil loan fee for Raspadori, not the 30 mil obligation. Obligation is like a regular purchase so around 20 mil net mercato ( surplus not defcit ). Inter had around 32 mil net mercato with much higher salaries. Just Lukaku salary is around 20 mil gross! Just the 1 year cost of Lukaku is more than 1 year amortization plus salary of all Milan's new transfers!

Roma is not even in CL and made over 200 mil of losses last year. Milan just made 60 mil loss.

Milan is a 7 time CL winner. You want the owner to run the club as if it is a similar club to Napoli, Roma etc....?? Milan should be above these other Serie A shit clubs. Milan have millions more fans all around the world.

If they dont trust management, then replace them. You want them to both keep the management plus also continue with this stingy, blood sucking business of theirs??

 

[voom]

Valencia sacked Gattuso. Every serious club is doing these changes, but not us.
-Worst title defense in the history
-Humiliating exit from Coppa
-Trashed by merda in the Super Cup
-Completely outplayed by Lecce
-Humiliating loss against Lazio
-Biggest home defeat in the last 30 years against the 17th team in the ranking
-Worst defense in the top 5 leagues in 2023 - 98th place out of 98 teams
-Awful gameplay
-Constant injuries and terrible management on the physical condition of the players

Not enough for sacking apparently

Be Patient .All good things comes to those who wait.

 

[Curupira]

Be Patient .All good things comes to those who wait.

Except Zaniolo, when we offer 12m paid over 3 years to Roma this summer for him

 

[Curupira]

If were gonna still act like peasants next summer then try the following:

Zaniolo for free
Kessie or Amrabat for whatever cost (25m I guess)
Get experienced CB, Smalling for free perhaps
Get a proper striker for 30m

jivara, i thought I was cheap, but man you drive a hard bargain

 

[Massaro94]

I would even take Giampaolo

 

[voom]

Except Zaniolo, when we offer 12m paid over 3 years to Roma this summer for him

Remember same thing happened with Romagnoli .Romagnoli was eating alone in AS Roma before he signed for us. It's the same pattern. Zaniolo knows this.
Mou dont want him ,and fans are calling him new Hitler.

 

[Samaldinho]

Before Adli came to Milan, I thought he looked quite talented. But then I gave Pioli the benefit of the doubt. But now I'm not that sure of it ( Pioli ) anymore!!

Thiaw and Vranckx were signed as gap fillers ( 10 mil money left to spend and 2 positions to fill ), so if there is a lower chance they make it. Adli wasn't signed as a gap filler because you sign gap fillers to fill an immediate gap in the squad, you don't sign them to keep them on loan. Adli seems a player the management carefully scouted and believed in...

Thiaw had a lot of hype before coming here, and seeing him with the u21's, he looks impressive. Even if I made fun of him before, lol. Vranckx is also a very highly rated talent, but he's raw, like Thiaw, and when I saw him for the u21's, again, super impressed.

I didn't know anything about Adli before he came here, not a thing. I just watched him at Bordeaux while we loaned him there, because I was really curious. I thought he was being brought in as a vice-Bennacer or as a potential replacement for him. His team was terrible, truly terrible, but he was really impressive--but he wasn't playing in Bennacer's spot. He really looked like what we wanted from a CAM. He was someone that they scouted before and let's say Adli disappointed them over his loan year, they could have sold Adli, why not? But they didn't. So I have no idea what the plan is for him or went wrong. Because he did really well in pre-season.

Maybe he is an asshole? Maybe he is lazy? I have no idea what the issue is. Adli isn't trying to take over Tonali or Bennacer's spot, or Leao, or Theo, he's fighting with Brahim and CDK. If they were lighting it up, week-in, week-out, screw Adli. But they're not. We've had to endure two years of Brahim being super inconsistent until we got this year's Brahim, who is still inconsistent, but now a useful squad player, from time-to-time.

The Derby is coming at the worst time, it's terrible.

 

[SecondStar]

I would even take Giampaolo

 

[Alo88]

This is a really long post bro

I just saw "I strongly disagree" and when people say that to me they're usually wrong.

I see someone is afraid of not being right