The Rumour Commode XLI: Ragnarok

[Storkness]

Yunus Musah

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But I think as you say, a structured deal for Frattesi isn't the worst move... Knows the league and all that.

Maybe they do a buy one get one half price if we grab Berardi as well

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Kamada for free, then a striker... Oh my xxx

I want musah

 

[Wild]

The part under the scudetto badge looks like a face

Now u can't unsee it

Its a pirate with a mustache.

 

[Hitchens]

Viderekoblingsmerknad

 

[Samaldinho]

Believe it or not, that derby set the tone for subsequent derbies, we were having the edge vs them in the derbies prior to that match, the tone was changing but that stupid match in the SuperCup changed everything. Gave Inter the blue print and tactics to beat us handily and our players mentality vs them suffered too.

In hindsight that match was more important than we thought…

In January, our entire team was in a terrible place. We didn't press, we were without Maignan, nearly every player was out-of-form, Giroud and Theo were shattered emotionally from losing a World Cup final--I can't imagine what it is like to lose a final like that, literally the dream of anyone, and you're right there and it's only once every four years... Usually players have time from the end of that tournament before they start playing again.

Pioli played Pobega as his CAM against Juve, to counter their 352, but did he do that against Inter? No. In fact, in our first leg Coppa Semifinal, he played Krunic there, and we tied 0-0, while playing much better. The second leg? He put Kessie there, and Kessie can't man-mark in that position, and we lost 3-0. Even though at 2-0, Bennacer scored a perfectly good and valid goal, and we only had to TIE, since there are away goals, but that goal was chalked off, for the most dubious "passive offsides" call you'll see (a worse one is against Giroud when we got robbed against Napoli... hey, is that a pattern?) but... so I wonder... what the fuck is Pioli learning?

Pioli learned from that game that he had to counter Inter's 352 with a back three himself. He just... did it wrong by playing fucking Origi and Giroud up top and dropping Leao, while Bennacer wasn't available, and playing... Messias as a RCM for the first time... ever while playing scared with Gabbia. It was insane from Pioli.

He didn't have Leao for the CL semi-final first leg, what does he do against Inter? Does he learn what he did against beating Conte's Spurs (who play very similar to Inter's 352) and recognize that he doesn't have Leao? No. He plays the same fucking 4231 and his entire man-marking system is torn apart as without the threat of Leao or pace down the left, and Pioli's tactics play into the same fucking pressing traps that Conte uses he wonders how things went wrong against this shitty Inter team.

Pioli made every mistake possible against Inter. He seemingly has learned nothing. That's why I'm pissed at him.

 

[MilanMB]

Let's be honest. Prime kaka shits on all farca players except messi. Even with messi, prime for prime its very tight. Between 2001-2007 2008 ish he was a monster. Him and Ronaldinho.

Messi scored 60-80 goals / during his prime what are u talking about

 

[Storkness]

I'm literally wearing a name tag on my short-sleeved collared shirt with a tie, with you, while we walk around, door-to-door, handling out pamphlets while trying to preach to people about Yacine Adli...

I don't like Brahim Diaz. I said "skilled for a 5-a-side game." C'mon man.

 

[brk]

30-35 for Sergente

 

[nonsonoqui]

Why is that?

Personally for me, I celebrated it as if we won the Scudetto. I was so starved for trophies back then. It was also the first trophy that Milan won where I was more self-aware, as an adult. Milan winning trophies when I was a kid was lovely but as an adult you truly understand it more.

I was that happy that I screamed and got drunk after it.


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This picture above moves me a lot. That trophy meant a lot to me.

Obviously the Scudetto in 2022 was next level but I’m never gonna undermine what that SuperCup in 2016 meant for me.

My personal life was a bit terrible at that period but those wins against Juventus in 2016, especially with SuperCup really filled me with joy and I don’t care if people tell me it was just a ‘stupid small SuperCup’, it wasn’t for me. Not in that context as a Milan fan when we didn’t win anything for 5 years and where we were struggling so much.

Understandable.

Personally, the Coppa Italia and Supercoppa are just two other minor tournaments for me. Coppa Italia is nice because you get to have the coccarda on your shirt the following year.

I was about 10 times happier with getting out of our group this year than that Supercoppa.

 

[papaberlu]

Madrid fans panicking over the idea of replacing Asensio with Brahim

 

[DonSilvio]

30-35 for Sergente

He's gonna cost 45m at the least isn't he?

 

[papaberlu]

He's gonna cost 45m at the least isn't he?

Na that's probably the right figure

but I think the biggest impediment to him joining Milan is his salary

I personally don't see it happening

 

[brk]

Do we get anything in return for developing him?

 

[Curupira]

Do we get anything in return for developing him?

If the option and the buy back option is all bullshit, then we got a player who filled the gaps until we looked for a real Hakan replacement.

 

[Curupira]

Na that's probably the right figure

but I think the biggest impediment to him joining Milan is his salary

I personally don't see it happening

You'd think he would ask for at least 4.5m.

 

[papaberlu]

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You'd think he would ask for at least 4.5m.

I'd imagine a lot more

It's gonna be the biggest deal of his life and there will be competition

I'm just not ready for a timeline where Marotta swindles his way into SMS

 

[Samaldinho]

I don't look at it like that.

We aren't buying winners like we were under prime-Berlusconi either and these experiences from winning doesn't just come out of thin air. There's a reason Madrid was willing to loan us Brahim with only an option to buy for 3 years, same with why Messias only cost 5m despite having better stats than some other players. Look at them missing big shots against Inter that a star during Berlusconi era would have buried.

Our players need more experience. And they should want to win everything and have that mentality IF we are really looking to build a group that will "dominate in CL in 3-5 years" instead of just trying to become the middle man ourselves and sustain. I think winning any of these said trophies is great experience if we do still have some ambitions of getting back to the top.

I think they got plenty of experience winning the Scudetto as infants and getting to a CL semi-final, which could have been very different (a final) if they had their best player healthy (and Bennacer) and Pioli hadn't went on a bender beforehand.

I think looking at Coppa Italia exits as some huge missed opportunity is (with respect) trying to find something to complain about.

I also think it's about "lowering our expectations" which is really code for "we're not what we used to be." We're not Dortmund, no matter how hard you try, lol. Maldini didn't come here to build a Dortmund. The fact we haven't sold Leao, Theo, Maignan, Tomori, etc was the big test case for that, remember?

I don't care about the Coppa Italia. Nor do I care about the EL. No matter what you say, lol, that's not going to change. Those are competitions for Inter.

Javier Zanetti, who isn't even a top 5 RB of all time, felt like he "made it" because he finally won... one CL. Wow. Good for him. Little 'ole tractor. Just like Drew Brees felt like he made it because he finally won... a ring. Maldini is a Tom Brady, a Joe Montana. Michael Jordan, Kobe, etc. Inter... and their ilk... they're like... um... some random basketball player who finally won a ring who I don't remember because, unlike Maldini, no one knows or gives a shit about Javier Zanetti and Inter.

This is Milan, my friend. Here, let me put it in the terms that I know works best for you:

(And again, we're the Red Sox, not the A's, since... Maldini... y'know... won a championship.)

Edit: this is supposed to be in a jokey tone, sorry if it doesn't come off that way. It's just banter and fucking around. I just look at the Coppa Italia and all that as the NIT.

 

[brk]

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You'd think he would ask for at least 4.5m.

He's not on the growth decree unfortunately. That's a big negative for him. 4.5 net would be over 8m gross, which would bring him close to what we're paying Leao now.

 

[Cloren]

Come on he wants to play.

Asensio over Diaz, we can’t be choosers when it comes to RW. Beggars can’t be choosers.

But the thought of Diaz leaving, and we no longer have to see Saele/Messias on RW is making me hyperventilate in excitement.

Asensio this season was way better than Diaz.

 

[Kojak]

SMS for 30-35m is a no-brainier…c.15 goal contributions per season would do us wonders.

 

[Cloren]

Understandable.

Personally, the Coppa Italia and Supercoppa are just two other minor tournaments for me. Coppa Italia is nice because you get to have the coccarda on your shirt the following year.

I was about 10 times happier with getting out of our group this year than that Supercoppa.

I’d say I felt that when we beat Spurs this season. I also went out drinking after that of course.

Beating Napoli in the QF felt in parts even better than the Scudetto win.

CLs wins are indeed something else. So I get that point of view too.

 

[Milan10]

I hate the results against Inter and blame Pioli a fair bit for those. I think our failures this season are multi faceted tho, and I think a weak squad has limited Pioli even more than he actually is tactically. To me giving him a squad with depth and quality is our best option. He's delivered a CL semi this season, like it or not. Too many here choose to take only the bad with the Pioli, he has shown many good things this season, particularly two knockout ties that were handled in the best traditions of AC Milan.

Adli? I would have liked to see him given more chances, but that doesn't make me think that I know better than Pioli. Contrary to some here, I don't think Adli is some magic spell that would have fixed our season. People have bashed Pioli for his treatment of Thiaw, but I'd say the way he's integrated him situates Thiaw very nicely for a future starting spot here. Vranckx? Looked promising at times, and certainly not at other times. CDK is a ludicrous flop so far, but if he turns out better next season and becomes something, the 43m(most of the window last season) spent on him and Thiaw will have been a long term success. CDK has a long ways to go before that happens tho.

For me this season is largely a story of a misfiring and poorly constructed squad, with several intangibles. There wasn't sufficient reason to expect this many players to do this poorly, but here we are. It's sport. As I've said before I think this was an important season to experience for the squad, and however much I hated that exit vs Inter I think it will be important motivational fuel for many of the promising starters in this squad.

I freely admit mistakes which I think is a healthy practice. I have vastly underestimated how much of a mistake it was not replacing Kessie. We need a feared midfield, we had that with him and now it was a mess. I nevertheless loath Kessie himself and never want him back, but his output should have been replaced and wasn't.

But first we have to secure CL. Dai.

We are on the same page, bro.

One of the biggest criticisms of Pioli is that he has struggled against the bottom half of the table, but in my opinion that is largely where a lack of talent and creativity gets exposed in Italy. Even very bad sides can defend relatively well in Italy, especially when they bunker as teams do against us.

Pioli’s system is effective when he can press the living fuck out of an opponent, even relegation sides choke under that pressure as they are having to play out of their own third of the pitch. But because of injuries and lack of quality depth, he wasn’t able to do that and had to switch to more of a counter attacking style, which does not work against bunkered sides.

The main criticism has boiled down to: Pioli hasn’t found a way to break teams down. I would counter by saying, actually, yes he has a system that breaks down top teams and relegation sides, but important pieces of that system have been stripped away from him and replaced with poor quality players. Kessie was replaced with Tomasso Pobega, need I say more?

Here in the Land of the Free, we say, “It’s about the Jimmies and Joes, not the Xs and Os.” It’s a folksy way of saying, there is no tactical solution to a personnel problem, which Samaldinho was correct about, he only had it in reverse IMO.

Pioli isn’t without blame, his staff seems to suck. We are still horrible at scoring/defending set pieces. Our injury record is about as bad as America experience in ‘Nam, and we continue to cripple our players in training. How much of that is his fault or management’s for not giving him the funds to upgrade his staff, none of us know. Maybe a combination. And finally, there are things he could have done differently this season ie: Playing Adli instead of CDK and placing Brahim at RW.

Overall, I place the vast majority of the blame on MMM and RedBird. Pioli has proven that he can win, and more importantly he has proven that he can win when he’s not expects to (overachieve in other words). Honestly, I think our performance this season is still in the realm of over achieving and if not meeting expectations. This squad should not have reached a CL semi-final and honestly in hindsight it’s not surprising to me that we have struggled in Italy.

 

[Cloren]

Selling Messias, not buying Diaz.

Getting Kamada and Asensio on free. Spending 35-40m on SMS to upgrade our midfield.

For me all these are no brainer deals. We get an upgrade on CAM, RW and a much better rotational player than Messias.

Issue with Asensio/SMS though are definitely the wages sadly. They demand too much.

I much rather get Asensio on free + additional more wages than spend 30m on Diaz though…

 

[Panache]

Rebic did quite fell as stiker when he was in form. He's taller than Openda but didn't really use his height / heading much. Milan played better as a team with in form Rebic as striker than they have with Giroud. Rebic is rarely in form though and now seems to have become really bad. This long ball to Giroud doesn't work too well for the team as a whole and they hardly score much using that. I'm not sure they should continue like this.

When teams sit back, you need a big CF to do the dirty work and force things. MANY teams in Serie A sit back and stifle the forwards. We need a big young CF with or without Openda. Openda + Thuram/Scammaca would put me more at ease. Just in case this Openda, small-forward-experiment doesn’t work.

 

[Cloren]

Ok I change my mind after seeing Bonaventura's hands touching a trophy.

Sam's right, this one is a fodder trophy, field primavera players + outcasts. My point about Europa League and Coppa still stands


(sorry to hear about your time back then, just joking above )

I think my first post in this forum was after that final

I think I joined this forum after Locatelli’s banger vs Juventus but it took time to get my account activated. But I think I posted for that final

After lurking for over a year I’d say

 

[Neruda2.0]

@Satria who is that bitch ?

 

[papaberlu]

When teams sit back, you need a big CF to do the dirty work and force things. MANY teams in Serie A sit back and stifle the forwards. We need a big young CF with or without Openda. Openda + Thuram/Scammaca would put me more at ease. Just in case this Openda, small-forward-experiment doesn’t work.

Normally I'd agree but given how the only time this team had a coherent attack was a perfectly healthy Ibra

I'd say a CF who can contribute to build-up is the bigger priority

 

[Panache]

Selling Messias, not buying Diaz.

Getting Kamada and Asensio on free. Spending 35-40m on SMS to upgrade our midfield.

For me all these are no brainer deals. We get an upgrade on CAM, RW and a much better rotational player than Messias.

Issue with Asensio/SMS though are definitely the wages sadly. They demand too much.

I much rather get Asensio on free + additional more wages than spend 30m on Diaz though…

You’ve written about Asensio 3 posts in a row. Are you hoping that the more you mention his name the higher the chances of us signing him?

 

[Cloren]

I think they got plenty of experience winning the Scudetto as infants and getting to a CL semi-final, which could have been very different (a final) if they had their best player healthy (and Bennacer) and Pioli hadn't went on a bender beforehand.

I think looking at Coppa Italia exits as some huge missed opportunity is (with respect) trying to find something to complain about.

I also think it's about "lowering our expectations" which is really code for "we're not what we used to be." We're not Dortmund, no matter how hard you try, lol. Maldini didn't come here to build a Dortmund. The fact we haven't sold Leao, Theo, Maignan, Tomori, etc was the big test case for that, remember?

I don't care about the Coppa Italia. Nor do I care about the EL. No matter what you say, lol, that's not going to change. Those are competitions for Inter.

Javier Zanetti, who isn't even a top 5 RB of all time, felt like he "made it" because he finally won... one CL. Wow. Good for him. Little 'ole tractor. Just like Drew Brees felt like he made it because he finally won... a ring. Maldini is a Tom Brady, a Joe Montana. Michael Jordan, Kobe, etc. Inter... and their ilk... they're like... um... some random basketball player who finally won a ring who I don't remember because, unlike Maldini, no one knows or gives a shit about Javier Zanetti and Inter.

This is Milan, my friend. Here, let me put it in the terms that I know works best for you:

(And again, we're the Red Sox, not the A's, since... Maldini... y'know... won a championship.)

Edit: this is supposed to be in a jokey tone, sorry if it doesn't come off that way. It's just banter and fucking around. I just look at the Coppa Italia and all that as the NIT.

I don’t want to overvalue Coppa Italia or SuperCoppa either, they’re minor tournaments but all I’m saying is that it would be nice to win them especially in an era where we are starved of trophies and aren’t winning the league/CL on a consistent basis. I’m not saying they should be our main priority obviously but it would be nice to put some effort into it, which we did tbf, and not dismiss them. In a season like this, a Coppa Italia would have been a semi-consolation. Like for Madrid that’s how they see their Copa Del Rey.

 

[Wild]

Selling Messias, not buying Diaz.

Getting Kamada and Asensio on free. Spending 35-40m on SMS to upgrade our midfield.

For me all these are no brainer deals. We get an upgrade on CAM, RW and a much better rotational player than Messias.

Issue with Asensio/SMS though are definitely the wages sadly. They demand too much.

I much rather get Asensio on free + additional more wages than spend 30m on Diaz though…

Asensio , Kamada , SMS & Thuram would be a near perfect mercato.

 

[Cloren]

You’ve written about Asensio 3 posts in a row. Are you hoping that the more you mention his name the higher the chances of us signing him?

Let’s just say seeing Messias/Saele as RWs and Diaz at CAM for 2-3 seasons has made me go crazy I’m willing to take even the slightest upgrade over them.