The Rumour Commode XXXIX: A Cardinal Sin

[Massaro94]

Spend kings Chelsea not even in the picture

Apex predators bro

 

[ROSSONERI7]

will read the whole thread later when i get to sit and settle somewhere.... but for that first tweet.

 

[Samaldinho]

Hauge was loan with option and conditional obligation ( the team not get relegated ). Regular obligation is almost the same as a regular purchase. And if you sign a 35 mil player, only 1/5th or 7 mil ( 35 / 5 =7) comes on the year's books not the whole amount!! You amortize over the length of the contract. So basically there is almost zero difference between regular purchase and obligation. Obligation affects the budget the same way as a purchase. Even UEFA counts it like that for FFP!

Or in other words, do you think if Maldini wanted to sign a 35 mil winger with loan plus obligation on top of the other transfers, would the owners have allowed it because it was loan plus obligation and not straight purchase? Or is only Napoli allowed to count loan plus obligation in the way you described? Maybe Maldini can even then combine 3 mercatos in one by doing 2 year loans plus obligation!!

How can you count transfer fees without looking at salaries? If the management can sign players with 20 mil gross salaries like Lukaku, then they can do more free deals without spending as much on transfers. For example they could signed Ziyech on loan and given him 6 mil net salary. They could have also kept Kessie with 6 mil salary as well. Are you saying that high salaries don't hurt your books and only transfer spending does??

And Milan's books were in much better shape than Roma, Inter and Juve. Milan only made 60 mil in losses which is quite good. Roma made over 200 mil! And then Milan increased their shirt sponsorship recently by around 50 mil. So not all Serie is in bad financial shape!

If Leao doesn't renew they should sell him. But if they just sell their best players for the sake of selling, how is that going to help top 4 chances. And then how will that increase the club's revenues? Fucking Gerry wants to get Milan's revenue to 500 mil. How the fuck is he going to do that by running the club like Napoli?

Abramovich bought Chelsea for 300-400 mil. He then paid around 1 bil in club losses over the years to make Chelsea a big club. Then the club got sold for a few billion! They didn't let him keep the proceeds because of sanctions but he would have come out in profit if they had. That's how you grow big clubs, not this bullshit 35 mil net mercato spending.

I agree with a lot of your sentiment, but I just wanna point out:

(1) Even if you amortize a purchase on your books and if FFP looks at it over the life of that player's contract, you still, generally, have to pay that money up front. So you aren't paying like 5m a year for a 25m transfer, but you're actually paying 25m to the other club, but for FFP and accounting purposes the cost is spread out over the use of that asset, in this case, a player.

If Maldini could pay for a deal over a couple years, I think he would do that more often. Clubs usually want the money up front, particularly in the ranges we are dealing with, as there is more flexibility in payment structures with the mega transfers, rather than the ones we are doing.

You know this, but I think it might one of the reasons why our owners are being so cheap--and it's actually annoying.

(2) Abramovich made money, but a big part of the growth of his product was the massive increase in the value of the land that Chelsea own (but don't fully control, lol) for the stadium, etc. but even more importantly the other bit is the massive growth of the EPL, which he helped by bringing attention to the EPL with flashy transfers and all that, but it was also because the EPL worked together to grow their brand, while Serie A clubs actively seek to destroy each other.

He also sunk money into the club to provide him the goodwill of the English public as an insurance plan for what eventually happened with Russia. It wasn't to make money, it was to protect other money and assets of his. So I don't think he saw the money he put into Chelsea as the key towards growing the club as much as it was him putting money into something that would shield him if he ever needed. Chelsea lost a lot of money, but that's like Nintendo or Sony selling their game systems at a loss so that they can make money on selling you games. Chelsea was something that lost him money, so he could protect his other money.

I just don't think Abramovich is the best parallel for what is happening with us. Manchester United and Liverpool might be the better examples, using American owners and their goals, profit incentives, etc. Why we aren't spending more money, when we should be, I have no idea.

I think it has to be related to the ~95m in expenses that keep impacting our balances, whatever the hell those expenses are.

 

[Curupira]

L'equipe:
Hekky Z to PSG

@Kojak scouting

 

[Samaldinho]

If you have 50m for next summer, plus sales, what would you do in the summer? Be aware of lists.

 

[Kaka92]

This behavior of Zaniolo is absolutely awful and I don't understand why anyone would want such a tumor in the team. Let's just put ourselves in a situation where one of our players behaves like this and ask ourselves if we would like him to stay.


And given his terrible form, not playing for six months would be the icing on the cake. How shit would he be then?

 

[ROSSONERI7]

If you have 50m for next summer, plus sales, what would you do in the summer? Be aware of lists.

buy a mansion in my home country and 1 vacation home in the Maldives. 5-10m
40-45m remaining, new business venture and investments.

fuck that ! i invested my imaginary 50m in Milan last season and only got CDK ... will make better use of it next season !

 

[Curupira]

If you have 50m for next summer, plus sales, what would you do in the summer? Be aware of lists.

Zaniolo for cam
Berardi for rw
Scamacca for CF
Frattesi in Bennacer out

 

[Curupira]

Sirigu or Marchetti for free to make sure we fill our veteran keeper quota

 

[Caladan]

If you have 50m for next summer, plus sales, what would you do in the summer? Be aware of lists.

I will buy Samaldinho which will do my merceto list from his 50 mln. I wont do nothing.

 

[Massaro94]

Add naby Keitta and that's 200m lol

 

[omer486]

I agree with a lot of your sentiment, but I just wanna point out:

(1) Even if you amortize a purchase on your books and if FFP looks at it over the life of that player's contract, you still, generally, have to pay that money up front. So you aren't paying like 5m a year for a 25m transfer, but you're actually paying 25m to the other club, but for FFP and accounting purposes the cost is spread out over the use of that asset, in this case, a player.

If Maldini could pay for a deal over a couple years, I think he would do that more often. Clubs usually want the money up front, particularly in the ranges we are dealing with, as there is more flexibility in payment structures with the mega transfers, rather than the ones we are doing.

(2) Abramovich made money, but a big part of the growth of his product was the massive increase in the value of the land that Chelsea own (but don't fully control, lol) for the stadium, etc. but even more importantly the other bit is the massive growth of the EPL, which he helped by bringing attention to the EPL with flashy transfers and all that, but it was also because the EPL worked together to grow their brand, while Serie A clubs actively seek to destroy each other.

He also sunk money into the club to provide him the goodwill of the English public as an insurance plan for what eventually happened with Russia. It wasn't to make money, it was to protect other money and assets of his. So I don't think he saw the money he put into Chelsea as the key towards growing the club as much as it was him putting money into something that would shield him if he ever needed. Chelsea lost a lot of money, but that's like Nintendo or Sony selling their game systems at a loss so that they can make money on selling you games. Chelsea was something that lost him money, so he could protect his other money.

I just don't think Abramovich is the best parallel for what is happening with us. Manchester United and Liverpool might be the better examples, using American owners and their goals, profit incentives, etc. Why we aren't spending more money, when we should be, I have no idea.

I think it has to be related to the ~95m in expenses that keep impacting our balances, whatever the hell those expenses are.

Even if you have to pay the whole amount up front and you don't have that much liquidity, a big club can easily take a loan for 30 mil for 1 year. . So in the end the only difference would be 1 year's worth of interest on the net amount ( obligation amount - loan fee) versus having to pay the obligation amount the following year.

Regarding Abramovich, the Europeans / UK still tried to fuck him over. But I read he funneled his assets under special protected trusts and also under the names of different family members, so he was able to save some stuff but some assets like his Villa in France still got confiscated. Owning Chelsea really didn't help in that sense The UK govt didn't even renew his UK residence visa some years back, much before the current war. Really he should have sold Chelsea before the invasion and then he would have kept all the proceeds. I think he felt too attached to the club and didn't want to sell it, until the UK government made it impossible that the club could continue as a EPL club under his ownership. Now, whether he deserved the sanctions or not, I can't say as I don't know the inside details of his involvement with Putin.

 

[Hitchens]

 

[Panache]

Perfect timing. Welcome Rino! He'll make all our prima donnas work twice as hard.

 

[Curupira]

Perfect timing. Welcome Rino! He'll make all our prima donnas work twice as hard.

Willing to leave when his time is up too

 

[Pigeon]

Zaniolo for cam
Berardi for rw
Scamacca for CF
Frattesi in Bennacer out

View attachment 14787

you gotta give them credit for selling their top players at very good prices tho.
scamacca - 36mil
raspadori - 5 + 25mil
boga - 22mil
now traore to bournemouth for 30mil
next year probably frattesi

that's scam on brugge level.

domenico…

 

[KujaIX]

Perfect timing. Welcome Rino! He'll make all our prima donnas work twice as hard.

Grinta! Grinta! Grinta!

Someone please photoshop Rino's face on the front of Grond from Lord of the Rings for this.

 

[Hitchens]

Longo: Negotiations going on between #Milan and #UniversidaddeChile for #Osorio: contacts even in these hours, the parties have not yet reached an agreement, discussions continue to arrive at a solution @cmdotcom

 

[KujaIX]

For me personally Pioli has done more than enough to be given another season. He got us back into the top 4 and won us a league title. Injuries and a lack of support from our owners has hindered this team.

I'd be gutted if he were to be given the boot.

It is funny how this has turned old alliances on its head.

I fully agree with this sentiment. Unless we literally continue this form, as in continue to not win any matches whatsoever and tumble down the table, I don't think he should be sacked. And he definitely shouldn't be sacked if his replacement is a Brocchi or Seedorf.

 

[MilanFan89]

This behavior of Zaniolo is absolutely awful and I don't understand why anyone would want such a tumor in the team. Let's just put ourselves in a situation where one of our players behaves like this and ask ourselves if we would like him to stay.


And given his terrible form, not playing for six months would be the icing on the cake. How shit would he be then?

Idd What will Zaniolo even bring to this team ?
God Maldini is terrible

 

[KujaIX]

So whats rhe solution then?

Just get your ass handed down to you every single game by anyone?

Just get some bs caretaker manager. No one can do any worse

The issue with this is that you are now thinking that it is impossible for Pioli to get back to the form which only 8 months ago was leading us to the title with 86 points.

While 'nobody can do any worse' may be true in terms of the fact that we've not won in 6 or whatever, it's also true that only last season Pioli was leading us to the title and only a few months ago we were neck and neck with Napoli. And yes, we have faltered, but the fact that we're only 2 points behind second AFTER all of that, does suggest that he's not the only one struggling.

If clubs acted as we are suggesting, Limone would have been sacked by Inter, Mourinho and Sarri would have gone, Allegri would have been sacked and Gasp too. Literally every other manager except for Spalletti has gone through these periods of form and yet they're still here and you're not asking for them to be sacked now.

 

[Curupira]

now traore to bournemouth for 30mil

After that, Sassuolo SD:

 

[markony]

F**k it, Pioli really lost it.
It's sad we miss Kessie so much, I mean, I would punch his smug face like now, but, he was a thank, gotta admit that.
Boys are really struggling, there's no one with balls to step in.

 

[KujaIX]

As you may have seen, I am not wanting Pioli out but am clearly not fully invested any more. The form does look terrible and it's difficult to see a route out - however, this has happened with Pioli twice before with us and we've bounced back both times.

Unless things become terminal and we are effectively out of CL race (and I mean really, not like people saying we are now) then he should get at least to the end of the season.

Also, while I do acknowledge that he has been inflexible this season, it does seem a little odd to beat management over the head for shit or non-purchases and then act like Pioli has been fully indulged. You cannot have one without the other. Either Pioli has been backed enough to not be performing like this - 2 points off second - or Maldini has done a terrible job. You can't have both.

 

[MilanFan89]

The issue with this is that you are now thinking that it is impossible for Pioli to get back to the form which only 8 months ago was leading us to the title with 86 points.

While 'nobody can do any worse' may be true in terms of the fact that we've not won in 6 or whatever, it's also true that only last season Pioli was leading us to the title and only a few months ago we were neck and neck with Napoli. And yes, we have faltered, but the fact that we're only 2 points behind second AFTER all of that, does suggest that he's not the only one struggling.

If clubs acted as we are suggesting, Limone would have been sacked by Inter, Mourinho and Sarri would have gone, Allegri would have been sacked and Gasp too. Literally every other manager except for Spalletti has gone through these periods of form and yet they're still here and you're not asking for them to be sacked now.

Milan is the only club in top 5 competitions who couldnt get any win in their last 6 games. Except bottom teams
Thats the difference

 

[gioiuzza]

Apparently we’re trying to close for Osorio tonight

 

[Panache]

For me personally Pioli has done more than enough to be given another season. He got us back into the top 4 and won us a league title. Injuries and a lack of support from our owners has hindered this team.

I'd be gutted if he were to be given the boot.

You're being too sentimental. If this form continues and we miss out on the CL, will you continue to feel that he deserves another year here? Where do you draw the line?

What if he were Mexican? Would you still give him another year?

 

[BaniCPT]

I really like this forum, like a bunch of guys around a mate's broken car, all with a solution to fix the fucker

 

[KujaIX]

No other club in top 5 competitions couldnt get 1 victory in their last 6 games
Thats the difference

True.

It is why it's so difficult. To me, he deserves time and a chance to turn it around. We had a run of dreadful form last year and the year before and came back - not as bad as this but still.

Only a couple of months ago we looked like we could definitely repeat even against Napoli and now we've not won in 6 and conceded 12 in the last 3.

Personally, and I may be the only one here, I could not have given less of a fuck about the cup and supercoppa. Of course, I'd rather we not lose 3-0 but I was not really affected in the slightest. The other results are what trouble me (and I am not denying that those two losses have an impact)

 

[Pigeon]

Apparently we’re trying to close for Osorio tonight

another 5mil out the window. luckily we are not working on a tight budget.