The Rumour Commode XLIV: Paragliding to Piolistine Crisis

Rigore to save your life: choose your player


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Hitchens

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@cmdotcom says that Moncada will meet with Ramadani over Jovics extension at the end of March. He has 8 goals in 22 apps in all comps, goal scored every 110 minutes. We have an option to extend annually, but on the basis of even stronger performances this month Jovic could be offered a two year contract starting this summer.

Interesting. This deal has been such a tremendous success vs expectations. He was once the toast of Europe. Who will partner him next year?
 

Deep Fried Pizza & Chips

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Can someone confirm the fee set on the option to buy for Chaka Traore? Saw someone say it's 10 mil here and 25% sell on too.
I presume we therefore don't have a buy back clause on top of that? Would be annoying.

I wouldn't be surprised if they take the option if they're promoted, even if it's a fairly high fee for a promoted team.
I hear he's impressed.
They've got to have learned that a buy back make's sense... Unless they really just don't rate him.

And feel getting a kick back if he performs decently and moves on, that's enough for his "development" costs.

Primavera sales adding 10/20 million to the books every year consistently would be nice.... And having players to pad out deals for Italian based targets will be helpful.

I'm kinda surprised we just took the money for Chaka rather than maybe seeing him hit 5 Serie A goals and being part of a deal for a better player in the summer, with a sensible buy back inserted.

This looks like an opportunity sale rather than a conscious decision over time.
 

vB9

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vB9

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“I love great goals, of course I’d like to score more, but I also make assists, I am a complete player,” - rafa
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vB9

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Leao also spoke about his relationship with club owner Cardinale.

“We don’t meet too often but he likes and helps me. He even gave us his mobile number but I’ve never called him. I don’t want to disturb him; CEO Giorgio Furlani is close to us. He even speaks Portuguese, he’s a great person.”
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tonyb

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They've got to have learned that a buy back make's sense... Unless they really just don't rate him.

And feel getting a kick back if he performs decently and moves on, that's enough for his "development" costs.

Primavera sales adding 10/20 million to the books every year consistently would be nice.... And having players to pad out deals for Italian based targets will be helpful.

I'm kinda surprised we just took the money for Chaka rather than maybe seeing him hit 5 Serie A goals and being part of a deal for a better player in the summer, with a sensible buy back inserted.

This looks like an opportunity sale rather than a conscious decision over time.

The fact he has a few apps and 2 goals for us leads me to think we could've loaned him out to a team that would've given him regular football - without an option being given.
Usually you have to do that, to give the team an incentive to play him. A lower placed Serie B team would've taken him on a dry loan and still played him. Or even loan him out abroad.

It looks more like a Galliani move. Bad strategy and timing on when to sell a young player.

Having said all this, it's highly unlikely that Palermo take the option if they don't go up. Even if they go up, it's a decent figure that they'll need to cough up. Hopefully he does well enough there, isn't bought and we loan him to a decent team next season.
 

vB9

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lying bastard! there is very little aesthetic appeal to his game
 

Cloren

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Excl: #Conte and #Milan defined staff (and related compensation) on the day. #Ibra director of a large operation. Milan 2024/2025 starts with Antonio Conte! Deal done ✍🏻

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Deep Fried Pizza & Chips

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"Cardinale said himself at the Financial Times’ ‘Business of Football Summit’: “Zlatan allows me to be in the States and at the same time on the field in Milan. We hired him in RedBird specifically for everything he can do in football. But above all, he is my proxy.”

Cardinale also explained that he speaks to Ibrahimovic several times a day, meaning Cardinale is constantly being fed information about the goings on in Milan of his club, something that the American clearly thinks is extremely valuable.

“We speak several times a day and he has the authority to be my voice with the players, with the staff, with anyone at Milan. It is very important above all because he has a lot of credibility to do it. If I had taken a person from New York and put him in Milan he would have had much less credibility than Zlatan. The way in which Zlatan speaks to the players, acting as an intermediary for the ownership, is truly unique. I don’t want to go to the changing rooms to do it, I want Zlatan to do it,” Cardinale explained."

I can't really fault this too much... A football guy being the owners proxy instead of the finance guys we've had this season.

An issue has hopefully been identified and resolved.

Hopefully it brings stability, transparency and results to the Milan universe.
 

BillyTheKid

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I am a teacher and would like to see the Pioli problem through a teacher's perspective. It is always difficult to deal with a new cohort of students, mainly because you do not know the personality of the students. You do not how they would react in certain circumstances. You will need some time to observe their behavior and adjust yours accordingly to get the best performance out of them. This should not be much different for a football coach, I believe. Every time you have a new player, you must spend some time with them and observe their behavior/performance. The difficulty of adjusting your tactics, man management, etc. increases exponentially when you have more and more new players.

Starting this summer, I was so disappointed by the management, simply because they committed far too many changes that destabilize any social institutions. They first fired Maldini, and then brought in too many players. At that point, I was confident that this ship would go into a very rough period, and we would see many ups and downs in the best-case scenario. I wrote that Pioli must be praised if he could achieve a top-4 and advance to the UCL knock-out stage. Obviously, the latter did not happen, but in my view that was mainly because we were extremely unlucky! If we could convert only one of the many chances we created against Newcastle, we would have achieved that goal. The former goal will be achieved, I believe. And, I guess we still have a good chance to win EL. So, Pioli still has a chance to actually "overachieve" this season.

In my view, Pioli's performance should be evaluated not only in terms of tactics, but in the light of the fact that the management gave him almost a brand-new squad. And, here, we are talking about human beings, not robots. It is not like we gave him a PlayStation controller to control virtual players. Each player brings in their own crazy, unpredictable behavioral attributes and circumstances. When these attributes meet other new players' and the existing ones’ it becomes a high-order nonlinear dynamic complex system to solve.

Overall, the team has performed well this season. Most likely, we will snatch the second spot next week. And we will be second only behind Inter who have been extraordinary this season (like how Napoli performed last season). If Inter had not been super powerful this season, we would not have been so unhappy about our league results. So, is our squad the best in the league that we expect Pioli to achieve better than making us second? I genuinely believe that we do not have the best squad. So, expecting him to win the scudetto is a bit too much, especially with the circumstances I mentioned above.

Final word: we are all frustrated with some of the decisions Pioli has made and some of the words he has uttered. But honestly, have there been any coaches we were happy with in that regard? Every coach (human being) has his own idiosyncrasies that we cannot tolerate. For me, Pioli has had the minimum levels of idiosyncrasies, to be honest. I imagine a person like Conte would drive me mad after the first season! lol

Sorry about the long post. Just my personal reflections! Please feel free to ignore.
 

Correctamundo

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Okay, here's a thought... Adli is our Pirlo
Negative Sir, He lacks positional awareness for that role ++
can we get Gattuso as assistant coach, to turn Musah into a ball recovering,
What if I told you we could get a player who can pass, control and recover the ball with finesse? And he goes by the name Caqurete



Then drop fucking RLC because he ain't no Seedorf lol
Tijjani is our new Seedorf albeit from Temu, he can still grow and hopefully become closer to Dorfs level or at least better than Bonaventura(who was actually decent) no diss, make no mistake, but Tijjani for me so far is just..meh.
 

Alo88

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[...]

It looks more like a Galliani move. Bad strategy and timing on when to sell a young player.

[...]

I think it's the other way around. I have to admit I don't watch Primavera regularly, but whenever I caught their games, Chaka rarely impressed me. He's been with them for quite a while too, but honestly, he never seemed like anything special. And from what I've heard from folks who closely follow the Primavera, they also believe we have many players in development who seem more promising than him.

Then, the one time he and three other Primavera players got called up to the senior team because literally everyone else was injured, he made two appearances and scored two goals.

Now, there are two ways to see it: Either Chaka suddenly improved dramatically after a few hours of training with the senior squad, or it was just luck and coincidence.

Based on what I've seen from him in the Primavera, I personally think it's clearly the latter. The fact that we managed to sell him for 10M + 30% resale value based on a bit of hype he accidentally generated seems like perfect timing to me.

Since he wouldn't get enough game time to develop here with players like Leao and Okafor, the alternative would have been to loan him from one Serie B club to the next Serie C club to the next Serie A club and eventually sell him for a couple of millions, which is what we usually do with our most promising Primavera products if you care to check.

I applaud the management for being so quick to act with Chaka and making the most of the little hype he generated.
 

Deep Fried Pizza & Chips

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Negative Sir, He lacks positional awareness for that role ++

What if I told you we could get a player who can pass, control and recover the ball with finesse? And he goes by the name Caqurete




Tijjani is our new Seedorf albeit from Temu, he can still grow and hopefully become closer to Dorfs level or at least better than Bonaventura(who was actually decent) no diss, make no mistake, but Tijjani for me so far is just..meh.

The Deers - Dorf chat was funny, I see some similar characteristics but Dorf was levels above Tijj!!!

Deers has been a weird one, you can see there's a player in there. He has a decent football brain but lacks a little in the execution of some fundamentals.

This is like his 3 season in top flight football, so hopefully he's a bit late blooming.

He can.be a nice pick up...

Re: Adli, Pirlo wasn't exactly a kid when he arrived, let's give Adli some time.

Honestly none of this crop are close to the levels of that amazing if under achieving midfield of Pirlo, Dorf and Rino.

But they can become decent, and that's a good starting point to push on from... If the next coach could play them properly that will really help haha
 

Soldier_of_god

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Thank you, I try to do them whenever I can, but it took me like almost two hours with translating and boiling it a bit down and leave out the chattery parts :lol:

Infact there are a lot of interesting insights when you observe and compare the average positioning of our wingers, as well as their heatmap. I was surprised to see Pulisic positioned further up the field than Leao too. However, I believe this was influenced by Pellegrini being sent off early in the second half, effectively 'freeing' Pulisic from some of his defensive duties since Lazio was theoretically one man down on his side. As a result, Pulisic had more freedom to push higher up the pitch.

One additional point that Diddi and Pellegatti discussed in the video was how Leao seemed to be instructed to stick to his position and execute his trademark outside runs, while Pulisic, as usual, had to cover much more ground. This could have affected his effectiveness in the final third a bit.

Leao vs. Pulisic in Lazio vs. Milan:

View attachment 30587

Comparing this to the Atalanta game, there's a whole different picture. Firstly, looking at the average positioning of the players, we again see Leao positioned the highest up the field (and Adli as the clear regista behind the CMs).

Average position in Milan vs. Atalanta:

View attachment 30588

While the difference in positioning between Pulisic and Leao isn't stark, but when reflecting on that game, especially the 2nd half, we essentially dominated play in their own half for 45 minutes.

Now Leao vs. Pulisic heatmap:

View attachment 30589

In this context, Leao's action radius and work rate were insane. It's no wonder everyone here spoke after the game of Leao delivering a massive performance, praising him not just for the goal. An unleashed Leao is a fucking beast. I hope the reason why we often see him seemingly disappearing or restricted to his trademark move in many games is simply an instruction from Pioli.
I agree big meech is a beast when on song. Problem is that his partner is a donkey that cant move quick enough to link up play and exchange passes.

Big meech has to be supported by a new mobile cf next season
 

tonyb

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I think it's the other way around. I have to admit I don't watch Primavera regularly, but whenever I caught their games, Chaka rarely impressed me. He's been with them for quite a while too, but honestly, he never seemed like anything special. And from what I've heard from folks who closely follow the Primavera, they also believe we have many players in development who seem more promising than him.

Then, the one time he and three other Primavera players got called up to the senior team because literally everyone else was injured, he made two appearances and scored two goals.

Now, there are two ways to see it: Either Chaka suddenly improved dramatically after a few hours of training with the senior squad, or it was just luck and coincidence.

Based on what I've seen from him in the Primavera, I personally think it's clearly the latter. The fact that we managed to sell him for 10M + 30% resale value based on a bit of hype he accidentally generated seems like perfect timing to me.

Since he wouldn't get enough game time to develop here with players like Leao and Okafor, the alternative would have been to loan him from one Serie B club to the next Serie C club to the next Serie A club and eventually sell him for a couple of millions, which is what we usually do with our most promising Primavera products if you care to check.

I applaud the management for being so quick to act with Chaka and making the most of the little hype he generated.

I agree, from the primavera players that were given minutes - I was least excited/impressed with him and Bartesaghi. I also don't think we've definitely got the 10 mil locked up?
But I just think he has enough ability, or the room to get enough hype to get a little more than that.



Without Diaz anymore, there's room for one tiny Spaniard. Go get this kid. Our scouts have apparently been watching him. Looks like his value would sky rocket with us.
 

Soldier_of_god

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Excl: #Conte and #Milan defined staff (and related compensation) on the day. #Ibra director of a large operation. Milan 2024/2025 starts with Antonio Conte! Deal done ✍🏻

[ @il_legge ]

🤔🤔

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Don't fuck with me man.
This done for real?
 

Alo88

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[...]

I can't really fault this too much... A football guy being the owners proxy instead of the finance guys we've had this season.

An issue has hopefully been identified and resolved.

Hopefully it brings stability, transparency and results to the Milan universe.

I think that was the plan all along. When you take these statements and how Cardinale describes Zlatan you could strike Zlatan and replace his name with Maldini and those statements would still remain true.

IMO, he wanted Maldini to be what Zlatan is going to be, but for whatever reason, the collaboration failed and they parted ways. Though I don't think it failed because of a clash of ego and ambition alone because who else if not Zlatan is the epitome of ego and ambition?

And if Gerry hates other taking a shiny place in the spotlight, hiring Zlatan of all people to basically run Milan would be a very idiotic move. I don't think Gerry is an idiot. He's too successful with his other assets to be an idiot.
 

Master Smurf

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Forget Saudi coming in to fund Maldini’s usurp of Gerry…

Just take Bennacer off our hands and I am forever grateful :lol:
Now you sounding like Deep Fried :head:

Gerry's biggest get is a streamer - we need all the help we can get because this turtle strategy doesnt work if the smart guys arent hitting homeruns
 

Soldier_of_god

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The Deers - Dorf chat was funny, I see some similar characteristics but Dorf was levels above Tijj!!!

Deers has been a weird one, you can see there's a player in there. He has a decent football brain but lacks a little in the execution of some fundamentals.

This is like his 3 season in top flight football, so hopefully he's a bit late blooming.

He can.be a nice pick up...

Re: Adli, Pirlo wasn't exactly a kid when he arrived, let's give Adli some time.

Honestly none of this crop are close to the levels of that amazing if under achieving midfield of Pirlo, Dorf and Rino.

But they can become decent, and that's a good starting point to push on from... If the next coach could play them properly that will really help haha
Deers is more strootman calibre max.

He is not a patch on dorf. Dorf is an ATG level midfielder. Probably amongst best ever
 
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