Andrea Pirlo Thread

[hdcantona]

I like you Bear (n/h... well, maybe just a little )

Some nice posts in here lately from Bear, S+M84, San Pato and mad (others too which I may have missed...)

 

[Redman10]

There is a speed fetish on this board. Speed = greatness for some. I don't buy the he slow, weak argument b/c he no slower or stronger than Cesc and Xavi. I do buy that he is part of the problem. He is pretty one dimensional, does not really move out of his comfort zone and tends to hold the ball for too long which will usually end up in possession lost.

He is liability on defense but that comes from where he is position on the pitch, just in front of the defense and how nonchalant he is at times. Which put unnecessary pressure on the defense.


The best way to describe Pirlo is over-rated by some and under-rated by others.

 

[MilanMB]

There is a speed fetish on this board. Speed = greatness for some. I don't buy the he slow, weak argument b/c he no slower or stronger than Cesc and Xavi. I do buy that he is part of the problem. He is pretty one dimensional, does not really move out of his comfort zone and tends to hold the ball for too long which will usually end up in possession lost.

He is liability on defense but that comes from where he is position on the pitch, just in front of the defense and how nonchalant he is at times. Which put unnecessary pressure on the defense.


The best way to describe Pirlo is over-rated by some and under-rated by others.

I agree with most of this post... especially the bold part.

 

[drucurl]

Pirlo WAS a good player. He never was one of the world's best, EVER. He has GREAT technique and ball control, I'll give him that; and his passing is good, as well as his shooting. But, he is very slow, lazy, weak, bad in the air, and bad defensively.

Back in the days when we had the most technical midfield in Europe, with Pirlo, Seedorf, Kaka, and Rui Costa on the bench, Pirlo looked like a treat for the eye offensively. When surrounded with good ball players, he had the luxury to easily spread the passes right and left, and go for the occasional long killer ball. Also, even when he had a bad game -offensive wise- or had been marked, it didn't have THAT big of effect on our game, since we still had Seedorf to do the playmaking, as well as Kaka's and Sheva's individual brilliance.

Yet this still had its negative side. Pirlo has always been a defensive liability, and sometimes handling the defensive burden was too much of a task for Gattuso. Hence, why the introduction of an extra man in midfield, Ambrosini, was vital in our Champions League triumph in 2007. At the time when we had one of the best squads in the world, the great central defenders Maldini, Nesta, Stam; flying wingbacks like Cafu and Serginho; and an attack of Shevchenko and Pippo and Crespo at their prime, we still underachieved. A HUGE reason for that is Pirlo's defensive weakness, the 4-0 scandal against Deportivo and the Istanbul final come to mind. When we had the ball, Pirlo looked brilliant, a real maestro, the 'orchestrator' of the midfield. But when we lost it, our midfield was a disaster waiting to happen. For any reason if Gattuso collapsed defensively, which was mostly never really his fault since he can't handle all the defensive duties in midfield alone, especially if we're under pressure, the results turned rather embarrassing.

In conclusion, Pirlo's best days are WAY behind him. And these days were only possible when he was surrounded with great technical players as well, and relieved of any defensive duties, which in turn hurt us badly. Even at his best, he was more of liability than an asset. But now Pirlo has become more like a cancer to our team. Not only did we lose the great technical midfield, the attacking wingbacks, and the tireless Gattuso, Pirlo himself lost the physical qualities that he didn't even have in abundance to being with. He became slower, lazier, and EVEN more weak defensively. Which, combined with the fact that he's our only playmaker in midfield, and the fact that he got figured out by all teams anyway and is easily marked out of ANY game, the solution becomes simple really: we need to replace him.

Great post overall and I agree with the majority of it. Only one question though. Why do you seem to blame the 4-0 or even Istanbul collapse on Pirlo? If you have any clips at all of his f**k ups leading to an opponent's goal please share with the fine ppl of r&b

 

[Fiero]

Great post overall and I agree with the majority of it. Only one question though. Why do you seem to blame the 4-0 or even Istanbul collapse on Pirlo? If you have any clips at all of his f**k ups leading to an opponent's goal please share with the fine ppl of r&b

First goal: Pirlo standing there just like in Ashish's signature, not applying any pressure while he is close to the opponent and he is about to score, but who cares?! He's Il Maestro... His position is a DM but he isn't supposed to defend!

Then Depor waste two clear chances, while our whole team is defending for their lives EXCEPT il grande maestro who is jogging around, standing out of the penalty area doing absolute fuck all.

In the second half there is a golden chance gifted to Depor since Il Maestro was "orchestrating" in front of the penalty area and lost the ball under pressure.

He was then subbed after causing enough damage.

 

[Fiero]

Now, the Istanbul disaster is a complicated situation. It was a freakish incident that happens once in a million, and a lot of factors contributed, like the whole team relaxing, Liverpool's fighting spirit, luck, Gerrard's dive, Dida's howlers, etc...



AND the genuis of the Maestro (I'm NOT, by all means, blaming him ONLY, but yeah he was a reason). Our midfield was generally lightweight, and because Liverpool were pressuring us, and our DM doesn't defend (he's too busy orchestrating ) they were able to grab three goals in six minutes.

First goal: Pirlo was standing, could have jumped to stop the ball, but didn't. (for the member who was saying he doesn't need to have good jumping ability).

Second goal: It was a shot from a distance. Who should pressure? The DM! But Pirlo is not any DM, you see, he is the "deep lying playmaker", all he has to do is to "orchestrate". You can actually see Seedorf running his ass off pressing on Smicer, while Pirlo is just jogging as usual.

Third goal: Gerrard's fucking dive. Who was following him? The king Rino Gattuso who was giving his all. Unlike a certain Pirlo who was too busy to give a fuck. Just jogging by himself outside of the penalty area.

 

[drucurl]

Fiero I'm now officially your #1 fan . You've done more for the "Pirlo Is Such Shit"(piss ) movement in two posts than I've done since I've joined Wild and Wet Ones

 

[Dwa Milan]

lol the blaming is getting a bit silly here

 

[hdcantona]

that's just pathetic Fiero You are so much better than that.

 

[Sonny.Bill.Williams]

this has hit a all time low ......

 

[Sage]

First goal: Pirlo standing there just like in Ashish's signature, not applying any pressure while he is close to the opponent and he is about to score, but who cares?! He's Il Maestro... His position is a DM but he isn't supposed to defend!

Then Depor waste two clear chances, while our whole team is defending for their lives EXCEPT il grande maestro who is jogging around, standing out of the penalty area doing absolute fuck all.

In the second half there is a golden chance gifted to Depor since Il Maestro was "orchestrating" in front of the penalty area and lost the ball under pressure.

He was then subbed after causing enough damage.

Now, the Istanbul disaster is a complicated situation. It was a freakish incident that happens once in a million, and a lot of factors contributed, like the whole team relaxing, Liverpool's fighting spirit, luck, Gerrard's dive, Dida's howlers, etc...



AND the genuis of the Maestro (I'm NOT, by all means, blaming him ONLY, but yeah he was a reason). Our midfield was generally lightweight, and because Liverpool were pressuring us, and our DM doesn't defend (he's too busy orchestrating ) they were able to grab three goals in six minutes.

First goal: Pirlo was standing, could have jumped to stop the ball, but didn't. (for the member who was saying he doesn't need to have good jumping ability).

Second goal: It was a shot from a distance. Who should pressure? The DM! But Pirlo is not any DM, you see, he is the "deep lying playmaker", all he has to do is to "orchestrate". You can actually see Seedorf running his ass off pressing on Smicer, while Pirlo is just jogging as usual.

Third goal: Gerrard's fucking dive. Who was following him? The king Rino Gattuso who was giving his all. Unlike a certain Pirlo who was too busy to give a fuck. Just jogging by himself outside of the penalty area.

 

[Senatore_M84]

Wuhuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu , I cant wait to write a wall of text giving the idea that am neutral when am a Pirlo fan club.

The problem of this thread isnt haters coz most players in Milan are as average as Pirlo & you dont see haters bombing their thread claiming Ambro is shit , Ambro is average.
You know why ?
Coz there is no idiots claiming that Ambro is world class.
The problem is with over hyping Pirlo more than the haters who existed only as a reaction for ppl sucking his dick for playing good in one world cup with Italy & Italy is the key word here.

argh,

it's not about haters? Read half the posts 'fairy bitch' 'fuck off'. now how is that constructive?

it's not about being a pirlo fan or not. and i don't see how you can claim to be NEUTRAL on the guy and hate (which ou readily do) and then call those who give him credit "BIAS". Do you not see the hypocrisy? But i suppose in your mind it's nuetral cause apparently pirlo=average is a fact. You know a fact coaches like guardiola and carlo would disagree with.

Do I think pirlo has flaws? Yes. Do I think almost every player has flaws? Yes. I still believe he is an asset to the team and can make the team reach another level with right surroundings. That is all

 

[Senatore_M84]

First goal: Pirlo standing there just like in Ashish's signature, not applying any pressure while he is close to the opponent and he is about to score, but who cares?! He's Il Maestro... His position is a DM but he isn't supposed to defend!

you're joking right? He's a good 7-8 yards away and the striker (forgot is name) turned fast on the ball. Then he puts a decent move on Maldini who was possibly playing too far off him.

There is a man about 5-7 yards infront of pirlo who he had more responsbility on than a striker IN THE BOX (CB's responsbility)

BTW, the ball also skips RIGHT by cafu who was infinitely loser

 

[Dwa Milan]

seriously blaming a person for a whole team fiasco... is a bit out of line..
it's a team game, anyone who plays the game would really hate that kind of judgment

 

[melanman]

seriously blaming a person for a whole team fiasco... is a bit out of line..
it's a team game, anyone who plays the game would really hate that kind of judgment

This is true!

 

[adriancg]

Don't you people get it? These guys want Pirlo to be a playmaker, DM and sweeper all in one.

 

[melanman]

Don't you people get it? These guys want Pirlo to be a playmaker, DM and sweeper all in one.

personally I think they are just hanging on to the past......which is not a problem..but once you start talkin about things like hair, and stats that don't matter, your avoiding the real issues.

 

[Pedro]

This is getting serious hilarious. It's like, when Milan concede a goal and Pirlo is to see in the video he did it.

 

[Sonny.Bill.Williams]

 

[KujaIX]

OMFG Pirlo was injured during training and might miss the World Cup. If so, Italy have no chance whatsoever.

Source: Milannews.

 

[Pedro]

OMFG Pirlo was injured during training and might miss the World Cup. If so, Italy have no chance whatsoever.

Source: Milannews.

No Ambrosini and no Pirlo!!!!! edit: and no Nesta!!!!

Have I still reasons left to cheer for Azzurri?

Azzurri is screwed without Pirlo, oh wait, they already were...

 

[fengxiaoj]

I can't believe the amount of hatred and unconditional love I am seeing on this thread.

Those people who bash Pirlo and claim that his "fan boys" are unearthing years old footage to justify their love are now unearthing years old footage to justify their hate. At least the positive footage showed things that are undisputably done by Pirlo. Showing the highlights of a game and claiming that one player caused all the goals to be conceded, while ignoring that he did in fact make an assist against Liverpool is just mind numbingly biased.

You guys (on both extremes) are aware that you are not changing anyone's minds, right?

dru: IMO you flatter yourself when you say you joined Wild and Wet's side. They think Pirlo is horribly average, and their opinions hurt me (as a Pirlo fan) but they are still reasonable. You sound like you wish Pirlo never played for Milan.

P.S. Welcome to the forums, The Bear. Good posts, I agree with most of it.

 

[SpartanMilan]

Pirlo being out could totally sink Italy.

 

[hdcantona]

it's ok, it's only a Calf injury, he will miss the next warm up game but should be fine for South Africa.

 

[Sophie]

I really really really hope he's ok Italy would be massively screwed without him.

 

[drucurl]

seriously blaming a person for a whole team fiasco... is a bit out of line..
it's a team game, anyone who plays the game would really hate that kind of judgment

But that's the point...he never blamed him for the entire thing. In fact I think he was careful to emphasize that Pirlo was not solely to blame for what happened. However, as can be clearly seen from the above posts Pirlo is always absolved from ALL responsibility for anything bad when the truth is he could have done MUCH better in the situations he was in. Jogging around all game racks up more "ground covered" stats for the groupies to wank over but unless it has an end product which is MY main problem with gps, it's worthless. Look at how he keeps running after Robinho rapes him. He's still racking up mileage but if a he had made a half decent tackle he wouldn't have been moving that much but it would have been more useful in stopping him. It's the same for the "passes completed" stat. If they are mainly lateral or back to Nesta/Dida then they're meaningless no matter how many he gets right.
As regards the whole team thing yes you are right. But by the same token it isn't nice to single out Dida whom the Pirlo fans have no problem shitting on, for goals scored or Gila whom everybody shat on, for not scoring when Il Maestro's busy jogging around. I mean if he actually ran or jumped there's no telling how badly his hair might get messed up

 

[Sophie]

Pirlo is always absolved from ALL responsibility for anything bad

By who?? Pretty much every Pirlo fan who has posted in this thread has said that of course all players have faults, and he isn't perfect. It's the haters who come to this thread and go on and on about anything he didn't do or could have done better, even if he had a good game.

Hatred for any player isn't nice, but it's really really too much when people like Ashish write posts hoping that Pirlo is injured in the WC and things like that. He isn't leaving the team so just calm the hell down.

 

[milan1st]

NO Pirlo = No Italy !

 

[crazy4milan]

personally I think they are just hanging on to the past......which is not a problem..but once you start talkin about things like hair, and stats that don't matter, your avoiding the real issues.

The hair thing is just a light comment, it's as if I took seriously Farouk's and Wet Ones posts saying that one of the reasons that makes Mourinho a great coach and person is the fact that he cried 3 times. Or taking seriously Farouk's 2 posts on why Pirlo is the cause of the debacles at La Coruña and Istanbul.

There's some really good pro and against Pirlo arguments in the this past 10 pages, what I find interesting is that the best "against" Pirlo or his position posts come from either people that aren't fan boys or "haterz" and from the "fan boys" themselves.

 

[drucurl]

By who?? Pretty much every Pirlo fan who has posted in this thread has said that of course all players have faults, and he isn't perfect. It's the haters who come to this thread and go on and on about anything he didn't do or could have done better, even if he had a good game.

Hatred for any player isn't nice, but it's really really too much when people like Ashish write posts hoping that Pirlo is injured in the WC and things like that. He isn't leaving the team so just calm the hell down.

first of all don't confuse me with other haters. Many times I have praised him for his performances. However I am against him being excessively praised for the most basic and often meaningless tasks as his groupies persist in doing. This special treatment isn't given to anyone else on the team and that is wrong. I used to be a big Pirlo fan back when he was good and actually did the things that he still gets credit for...and even beyond that. Back then he had his detractors but i wasn't one. However I began to notice a massive spike in Seedorf hate when Pirlo was clearly worse. Then I noticed that the same things the forum cursed and threatened Seedorf for, they ignored when pirlo did it and worse. Things got so bad that Milano84 to his eternal credit embarked on a Clarence love campaign. But Pirlo didn't need that because other than the Pirlo haters which is less than 10 of us, the whole forum still actually genuinely think he's a great player. So it's not so much me hating him, which I don't but it's more me wondering what's the big deal over an ok to good player. This confusion gets worse when you consider how harshly Dinho is judged. And the things that ppl burn him for like tracking back and defending- Il Maestro should be doing FAR MORE- but doesn't to the required standard. Sure Pirlo fans admit it in passing but then they proceed to go back to worshiping him for the minor things he got right and pounding the others for what they did wrong. Case in point, Pirlo scored one goal all season long. But if you heard his fans talk about it you'd swear that he did it all the time and that that one goal was the best thing that happened this season. Meanwhile Dinho's exploits are relegated in importance for reasons such as "the team works for him" and "he did it vs shit clubs"