Andrea Pirlo Thread

Wild

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So me saying he did good in current season mean am not giving credit while his fans saying he was kick ass when he was with shit Milan simply coz he would have been good IF Milan had other players ?
Or maybe I claimed he wasnt good during the world cup also.
Hmmmmmmmmmmmm , nice way of thinking.
 

Senatore_M84

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So me saying he did good in current season mean am not giving credit while his fans saying he was kick ass when he was with shit Milan simply coz he would have been good IF Milan had other players ?
Or maybe I claimed he wasnt good during the world cup also.
Hmmmmmmmmmmmm , nice way of thinking.

You're not dumb enough to see why he's thriving?

Sure he definitely benefits from less fixtures (who doesn't?) and he has the added motivation. But more than that...

Juventus are a mobile team. Similar to barca being mobile (obviously less talent), and xavi thriving. As soon as it turned to give ball to messi, and let him create/xavi's assisted declined. Compare that to 2009, xavi's best year when they had perfect balance of henry, messi wide running and etoo at CF. Xavi gained 49p87349 assists.

Same thing happened in milan the minute Clarence was moved to AM (which was redundant... clarence tended to stop play and thus waste pirlo's passing) and even worse when we got Ronaldinho.


In the current milan, Pirlo would have thrived like he was starting to pre-injury.

It's not surprising he's been better for italy last 3 years and not milan because of mobility too.


Dude has gift of vision and passing range VERY few players in world do, and you know it. He might not be as good as xavi or even cesc, but the number of players who can dictate/control a game and pick out players runs consistently from CM are few and far between.



Nah my anger is all at management, cause for about 4 years pirlo's talents were wasted. We should have built a team based off him. Had kaka playing off a Cf. Making it mobile in attack, pirlo in middle holding it together. 4-4-1-1 persay. Totally wasted whern we constantly put static players who STOP the ball infront of him. I just happen to think it's berlusconi/galliani ******ation. We had some good players (pirlo, kaka), and we could have built an attack a certain way to make them all thrive, and instead they played FM and constantly made moves which made certain players influence way worse
 
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Thats an entirely different argument.
The debate was always if he was actually doing good or not in Milan.
You mentioned Xavi & even when he was making 8272782 assists you guys claimed Pirlo was better.
Any player will do better with a better team & Juve are a better team.
You imagine the current Juve vs Barca or Real ?
 

Senatore_M84

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Thats an entirely different argument.
The debate was always if he was actually doing good or not in Milan.
You mentioned Xavi & even when he was making 8272782 assists you guys claimed Pirlo was better.
Any player will do better with a better team & Juve are a better team.
You imagine the current Juve vs Barca or Real ?

It's not a different debate though.

My point was his performances diminished cause of a crappy assembled team. He did his job. You can't assist a nonexistent run.

And I think Juve is a lot closer than far from being ueropean elite. It'll take a couple BIG signings and additional depth, but they got the best CM in italy, one that can compete everywhere. A couple great defenders, need more. And of course a top class striker lacking.
 

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It's not a different debate though.
Are you serious ?
I never debated what would he do if .....
Actually I used to laugh of it.
The debate was always what he is in Milan.
People claiming he is the best simply coz he would ... if.....
That was the debate.
A game is played & I say he was average & hell break lose.
If he was shit coz he has a flu or didnt have runners doesnt mean he wasnt shit.
He was shit then we discuss why & that never happened.

My point was his performances diminished cause of a crappy assembled team. He did his job. You can't assist a nonexistent run.
Giving a fuck would have helped.
Even Ibra I dont like when he stands and just moan when the ball is still in play.
But Ibra would bring you a league on his own while not giving a fuck , Pirlo wont.

And I think Juve is a lot closer than far from being ueropean elite. It'll take a couple BIG signings and additional depth, but they got the best CM in italy, one that can compete everywhere. A couple great defenders, need more. And of course a top class striker lacking.
A couple of BIG signing separate half europe from becoming an elite team.
Inter's midfield is by far better than Juve's , its even ridiculous.
SerieA is in shit mode & Juve were just the less worse team hence they won the title.
Again , in the current team Juve's midfield will get overrun by most decent teams in CL.
 

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Ladri wont sign anyone but a ST. I could see Balo or Dzeko going there. I would bet my house than Juve will finish 3rd place regardless- they won't be able to handle all competitions. They just bought a new stadium for pete's sake, where is all of this big money coming from? I thought Kaddafi passed away?
 

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inter's midfield is far superior to milan's and juve's. They are definitely the under achievers this seaosn. They are just one world class striker like eto and a couple of Centre backs to be amongst the top 3 clubs in the world. For us, we need 2 quality fullbacks plus a world class DM and LCM to be the best in UCl. I will be happy if B and G just get rid of the deadwood and run the club efficiently by generating profits. It's really sad to see our club in such a dire financial situation, i don't mind if we lose scudetto again next year, so long as we are are willing to willing to cut down on the excessive wages being offered to our senatores.
 

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Just don't post any of his winning celebration pics here, please :(
 

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grazie maestro :star:

made coming out of the closet easier for the rest of us.

The Milk for all Juvilan fans.
 

Senatore_M84

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inter's midfield is far superior to milan's and juve's..

Is it?

Pirlo and Sneijder is a wash. Both are world class, albiet different style playmakers. Never seen Sneijder lead league in assists like pirlo, or control a tempo. Likewise, pirlo isn't the AM/#10 sneijder is.

Cambiasso, Zanetti, while able to give a great performance, are also older and there seasons show it. Give me marchisio/vidal anyday over them NOW.

The biggest thing, is conte made tactics to maximize his talent. Inter starting with Gasperini did not. Inter should be a top 4 team.
 

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Ladri wont sign anyone but a ST. I could see Balo or Dzeko going there. I would bet my house than Juve will finish 3rd place regardless- they won't be able to handle all competitions. They just bought a new stadium for pete's sake, where is all of this big money coming from? I thought Kaddafi passed away?

Idk... they will add a quality striker, like a Cavani or Higuian, which is something they currently lack, and to be honest a top CF is one of the only thing that their team really lacks...

They will add a couple of quality depth players too and also a good chance of a quality winger and they will be very dangerous again next season
 

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There is a realistic Ballon D'Or chance here actually, if Italy manages to upset the odds and win the Euro. It would be incredibly saddening if Pirlo manages to win that with Juventus.

Like @tancredipalmeri said in twitter last night,

Analysis of Serie A 2011-2012.Milan let Pirlo sign for Juventus.End of analysis
 

GreatKalu

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Analysis of Serie A 2011-2012.Milan let Pirlo sign for Juventus.End of analysis

Sums it up really. It would have been easier to take if it was for some young, upcoming players ... who would by now have gained experience and settled so that we could be optimistic for next season and the future ... but oh no it had to be for Van Boss, who's been decidedly average this term with no signs of doing anything significant next season.

Bayern let Van Boss go for free - they're in the UCL Final.
Milan let Pirlo go for free - we've lost our Scudetto.

Shit happens. Got to deal with it and move forward. We are all anxiously awaiting what should have been done last summer ... the arrival of a new anchor.
 
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ahh nice try trying to show some direct correlation between van bommel leaving and them reaching the final. They reached the finals with him, they reached the finals without him. It just tells me that he was replaced but he was only replaced the following season when gustavo fit in very well thanks to heynckes. As far as Van Gaal goes he paid the price for not having a mid field leader when he got his ass handed by a very average leonardo. Breno and co. got exposed big time without a DM and Schweini playing out of position.

We will see who has the last laugh tho. When Van B's so called replacement arrives.
 

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Is it?

Pirlo and Sneijder is a wash. Both are world class, albiet different style playmakers. Never seen Sneijder lead league in assists like pirlo, or control a tempo. Likewise, pirlo isn't the AM/#10 sneijder is.

Cambiasso, Zanetti, while able to give a great performance, are also older and there seasons show it. Give me marchisio/vidal anyday over them NOW.

The biggest thing, is conte made tactics to maximize his talent. Inter starting with Gasperini did not. Inter should be a top 4 team.
Sneijder is harder to stop.
And you forget Inter's depth.
Players like Guarin & Poli & even Stank will be useful for any team & even starters.
 

GreatKalu

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ahh nice try trying to show some direct correlation between van bommel leaving and them reaching the final. They reached the finals with him, they reached the finals without him. It just tells me that he was replaced but he was only replaced the following season when gustavo fit in very well thanks to heynckes. As far as Van Gaal goes he paid the price for not having a mid field leader when he got his ass handed by a very average leonardo. Breno and co. got exposed big time without a DM and Schweini playing out of position.

We will see who has the last laugh tho. When Van B's so called replacement arrives.

Its not a question of who's had the last laugh. Milan's midfield is in as worse a state as I've seen it in the past decade or so. Blame it on an over-reliance on Ibra ... blame it on Noce & Co. But Van Boss is very much part of a midfield which frankly sucks.
 

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Hunt left Milan & he is kicking ass, mistake so lets bring him back.
Gou took over the world the season he left Milan , wished we brought him back only to suck the next season.
Also Pirlowas away last season & woops a scudeo was won.
As soon as his boring ass was out we became better , played better , became faster , more fluidity & we won a long waited title & only luck prevented us from having a secong title & also a lot of cheatting.

My point , we all can have stupid theories.
And a juve's midfield barely edged milan's . . . . Wow.
 
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Its not a question of who's had the last laugh. Milan's midfield is in as worse a state as I've seen it in the past decade or so. Blame it on an over-reliance on Ibra ... blame it on Noce & Co. But Van Boss is very much part of a midfield which frankly sucks.

Its become a question with who has had the last laugh since van bommel is average according to you and any decent anchor can replace him. We will see who that decent anchor is and whether he will be able to replace him or not, or would he end up in a worse state than van bommel.

I am 100% sure tho there will be no mid field overhaul next year. And unless the guy coming in is a diarra level player he will not be able to replace van bommel who qutie frankly yesterday had a stand out game. But thats just my opinion.

We will know in a couple of months who is right and who is wrong.
 

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Its become a question with who has had the last laugh since van bommel is average according to you and any decent anchor can replace him. We will see who that decent anchor is and whether he will be able to replace him or not, or would he end up in a worse state than van bommel.

I am 100% sure tho there will be no mid field overhaul next year. And unless the guy coming in is a diarra level player he will not be able to replace van bommel who qutie frankly yesterday had a stand out game. But thats just my opinion.

We will know in a couple of months who is right and who is wrong.
Why are you so obsessed with being right? .. Also Sneijder had quite a lot of space most of the time, something a stand out van Bommel allowed.
 

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And unless the guy coming in is a diarra level player he will not be able to replace van bommel who qutie frankly yesterday had a stand out game. But thats just my opinion.

Whoa.
 

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Not interested in derailing a discussion about anchors with a point. But he looked good enough to me considering the horror show nocerino was having that pretty much left van B double teamed by alvarez and sneijder.

Regardless. We will see who the big shot anchor is that is coming in to replace him and how milan's defense performs next season.
 

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Ok ... going around circles when there really isn't any need to. Let me try to make the circle a straight line, so that we can better analyse the sequence of events.

1) Milan had Pirlo + 2 DMs on either side of a midfield 3. This worked fine until Kaka' left (regressed) and we didn't have any options other than Pirlo for creativity. Opponents charged down on Pirlo, giving him very little space, and we ended up being predictable.

2) Dinho catastrophe ... the expensive experiment that shouldn't have happened. Pirlo played alongside Ambro in a midfield 2.

3) We all agreed that the deep-lying playmaking BS (DLPBS henceforth) had been found out. And that Pirlo shouldn't be played at anchor primarily because of his defensive fragility - which had been improving with experience in his latter years at Milan.

4) We sign the Boss. The man who will dominate the area of the pitch right in front of defense. The job of an anchor is to close down any spaces between the midfield and the defense. The holes that the likes of Kaka' like to find. We finally abandon the DLPBS for a more orthodox defensively stable setup. However, it is important to add that the job of an anchor is to also provide an outlet for the defense to pass to. Giving your CBs more time on the ball than they would like is never a good thing. The anchor is supposed to show himself, receive the ball and keep possession. Pirlo is excellent in this regard ...

5) We let Pirlo go to Juve for free with this new philosophy

6) Milan concede more goals than last season, more goals than Juve, who have adopted the DLPBS philosophy. In addition, Milan have almost zero creativity in the middle of the park, relying on Ibra and the other forwards more than ever.

7) Van Boss is clearly showing his age, while Pirlo can be considered a candidate for Serie A player of season.

Feel free to correct the turn of events. But this is how I look at it.

Regardless, one thing is sure. Letting Pirlo go for free to Juve was a mistake. I don't think that can be argued.
 
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The bottom line is that at the end of the season,Pirlo is the champion of Serie A and whoever you guys are comparing bla bla him with are not.
 

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Milan didnt have much creativity in the middle of the park last year. Did just fine. Had a better defense than what juve have now last season and second best attack in the league. Why? no gattuso, cassano the only reliable forward apart from ibra got a major injury. But just to recap cassano with 5 months out had only 3 less assist than deep lying play maker? Anyway forget those points. Here is how i see it.

Juve suck at the front in terms of creativity, milan suck in mid field. It evens out in the end. And it is shown in the number of goals scored.

The main difference was in defense.
They were more stable. Why? Because a) barzaglie had an excellent season. b) Vidal and especially marchisio was utlized properly by conte. c) Their full backs have enough brains.

Milan's failures in defense a)Yes, Van Bommel aging but not as much credit as u give to our mid field downfall. b) Aquilani and Nocerino are no gattuso. No positional sense at all and no understanding of tackling. Probably worse than flamini in that respect. c) Boateng, the guy who used to defend from the front last year was out injured most of the season. He was an extra machine in the mid field that provided stability. No other player was able to fill his place other than emanuelson for a game or two. d) Random goof ups from abiatti and amelia cost us mucho points when they were quite solid last year. e) And a lot more individual errors from our CBs that were way more exposed this season than last season. Again i put it down to an unstable team due to injuries.


Let me sum it up if someone comes with a didnt read post. The point is this:
Letting go of Pirlo gave juve an edge that they didnt have in previous season. Not a doubt in that. But it was not the reason why we lost the league. Our downfall is our own doing (read milan's failures in defense) and not pirlo's good season.
 
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That's accurate. Van Bommel was always gonna be a short-term fix. He had one very good season. One very mediocre season. Time to look for a new solution now.

I dont think letting Pirlo go affected 'our team' negatively. But of course, it strengthened our rivals and directly led to them winning Lo Scudetto.

So indirectly a little short-sighted to do that.
 

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The way i would view this season is we lost on margins. If there was a gap of double digits between us and juve I would have gladly said that pirlo killed us off but our season was defined by moments of madness and lack of focus.

Pirlo going to them should not have made a difference in OUR scudetto run and i dont think it did.
 

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When titles are decided by 3 or 4 points, it simply comes down to the big games. Everyone beat the small teams in more or less similar fashion. But in the big matches, Milan screwed up. Juventus did well.

And this is also why Allegri carries a lot of responsibility. The role of a tactician is far more critical in big matches than in small matches. Allegri hasn't showed his capability in this role yet.
 

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And this is also why Allegri carries a lot of responsibility. The role of a tactician is far more critical in big matches than in small matches. Allegri hasn't showed his capability in this role yet.

:thumbsup:
 

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