Andrea Pirlo Thread

[Ashish]

I actually think only #1 is necessary. #4 is necessary more cause if Pato doesn't play it doesn't matter who our midfield is... we're fucked.

# 2. would be nice cause I don't rate flamini way you do, but really flams + ambro is sufficient if #1 comes. #3, i feel comfortable with our FBs TBH. I like antonini, abate's growth with zambrotta's exerience. We could upgrade it though, but it's not the most vital IMO.

I'm trying to leave my bias as much out of this as possible. Pirlo is one of my favorite players, i won't deny it. I will recognize his flaws. At same time, people are just ignoring all the things he CAN do, which r vital to milan's football, and its a certain skillset that only a handful of people globally have. It's just like saying we should replace ronaldinho cause he doesn't run as much as kaka.... or, thats a fact he doesn't. But what he can do.... i mean that's a gift no one else has (diagonal ball )

so lets imagine in current situation berlusca dont have enough money for #1 and #4 ? what cna we do with pirlo ?

anyway its fair you love that man and i hate him so i forgive you for being biased cause i cant hide the hate

 

[Wild]

Pirlo is our ONLY ball playing CM. Seedorf can do it, but he doesn't play CM anymore so he's not really relevant to topic.

Your entire wall of text revolve around this point which no one disagree.
Did me or any of the no Pirlo lovers said any player in "Milan" can do what Pirlo do ?
The fact that our midfielders arent good enough that they cant do a simple pass while Pirlo can is an indication of our poor midfield than Pirlo's quality.
Its hard to play without Pirlo coz we have average midfield but if we had the luxery to look outside Milan then we can easily replace him.
Lampard , Gerrard , Essien, Alonso , Xavi , Inie , DeRossi & more are among players who can offer more than Pirlo.
Players like Toure , Perrotta , Deco , Ballack , Diarra , Pizarro & more can do what Pirlo do , well with some maybe less but they make it up with other characteristics like more defensive or more offensive.
So as a conclusion : Pirlo is important in our average Milan but he is just another player world wide.

 

[Senatore_M84]

Your entire wall of text revolve around this point which no one disagree.
Did me or any of the no Pirlo lovers said any player in "Milan" can do what Pirlo do ?
The fact that our midfielders arent good enough that they cant do a simple pass while Pirlo can is an indication of our poor midfield than Pirlo's quality.
Its hard to play without Pirlo coz we have average midfield but if we had the luxery to look outside Milan then we can easily replace him.
Lampard , Gerrard , Essien, Alonso , Xavi , Inie , DeRossi & more are among players who can offer more than Pirlo.
Players like Toure , Perrotta , Deco , Ballack , Diarra , Pizarro & more can do what Pirlo do , well with some maybe less but they make it up with other characteristics like more defensive or more offensive.
So as a conclusion : Pirlo is important in our average Milan but he is just another player world wide.

But a lot of people were denying that simple point.


i might give you lampard cause of his goal scoring threat.
-Gerrard is about as much a CM as kaka is. Gerrard never plays it and when he does he struggles
-Essien, Flamini, Ambrosini in CM? Good luck. While he is better at what he does than pirlo, he doesn't solve the problem
-Ditto for alonso/De Rossi
-Xavi and Iniesta... MAYBE but we're talking the elite of the elite. So there you go. Even then I won't agree they would fit better in THIS milan than pirlo. You think Xavi/flamini/ambrosini would be better than pirlo? I'm not positive, but i'll agree... so we have 3 players who can do pirlos job marginally better.

I don't think the addition of iniesta and subtraction of pirlo can make milan a title team. I think the addition of iniesta + pirlo + flamini or ambrosini can make milan a title team. Does that make sense? Pirlo is our only non-average CM in terms of passing. So ultimately you're talking about an elite group of 3-5 you THINK could replace pirlo and make team better.

I still don't buy it, because losing pirlo for xavi or lampard won't make the team better. Adding xavi/lampard + what we have (including pirlo) might.

but anyway you slice it team will be weaker without Pirlo unless they get 2 new midfielders. One alone is requires with Pirlo. If he is sold, 2 would be required. And thats only point I'm trying to make. He is a very useful player who has certain characteristics which r great. Getting rid of him without some 200 mil war chest to reorganize entire team is a step backwards

 

[Sonny.Bill.Williams]

.....but anyway you slice it team will be weaker without Pirlo unless they get 2 new midfielders. One alone is requires with Pirlo. If he is sold, 2 would be required. And thats only point I'm trying to make. He is a very useful player who has certain characteristics which r great. Getting rid of him without some 200 mil war chest to reorganize entire team is a step backwards

+infinity

thats all

Grazie Maestro

@ wild: did you really think you'd get away with stealing an extra of these????

 

[Ashish]

to replace pirlo you need 200 million war chest.


Great

 

[Krash]

Its time to move on!!

 

[Sage]

ps...milanista_13_33....do u like the examples i used?? figured they were politically correct options

 

[Sage]

Pirlo is NOT average. God, some people are pathetic. You can say he's overhyped, that's possibly true. But what he does well, there are maybe 5 players in world on his level in terms of range of passing, and pace setting from CM blah blah blah

hey, you dont see people calling you pathetic for wanking on pirlo and seedorf, its just a matter of opinion, I think hes average, some people think hes shit, shouldnt you be able to handle this with some democracy!?

he is def. overhyped, not only by you or the other pirlo trolls on the forums, by serie A as a whole, only 5 players that can do what he does in terms of passing and pace setting? im sure you can find many players that can give you accurate 40 yard passes( c.zanetti, poulsen) and pass sideways.

It just shows how average the milan midfield is when we need players like pirlo to "control" the midfield and do the shit ANY decent passer can do.

I remember when Seedorf played in pirlo's position last season, and IMO he did a much better job.

 

[crazy4milan]

Is there someone who reads through this thread? Or do you guys come here and just blast your arguments and leave? Seems too much for me.

I did, had a good laugh while reading it, the last 12 pages have some incredibly funny arguments.

I still don't buy it, because losing pirlo for xavi or lampard won't make the team better. Adding xavi/lampard + what we have (including pirlo) might.

but anyway you slice it team will be weaker without Pirlo unless they get 2 new midfielders. One alone is requires with Pirlo. If he is sold, 2 would be required. And thats only point I'm trying to make. He is a very useful player who has certain characteristics which r great. Getting rid of him without some 200 mil war chest to reorganize entire team is a step backwards

This more or less is my general thought on the issue.

 

[Senatore_M84]

It just shows how average the milan midfield is when we need players like pirlo to "control" the midfield and do the shit ANY decent passer can do.

Deomcracy is for n00bs. I'm taking over the world totalitarian style

You're really underrating fact he constantly leads serie A in all passing statistics from completed passes, percentages completed to distance (aka most passes completed over 20 yards etc. etc.).

He's not amazing, but at the same time, when your only above average asset is your passing and brain, and there is no one worth a damn on the other end of the pass. Where is the problem? It's not coincidental when sheva and others left, aged etc. and weren't adequately replaced, his perceived contribution seeemd less.

I see same passes. I don't see huntelaar, seedorf (2010 version) doing same thing on ends of it like sheva or rui costa

I did, had a good laugh while reading it, the last 12 pages have some incredibly funny arguments.

such as what? specifically? Huntelaar contributed more than pirlo?

 

[crazy4milan]

such as what? specifically? Huntelaar contributed more than pirlo?

Yessss and this

he is def. overhyped, not only by you or the other pirlo trolls on the forums, by serie A as a whole, only 5 players that can do what he does in terms of passing and pace setting? im sure you can find many players that can give you accurate 40 yard passes( c.zanetti, poulsen) and pass sideways.

See he can't even say C.Zanetti + Poulsen with a straight face, he knows his joking (I assume he is considering Poulsen is unable to do that, and C. Zanetti is average-good player that does accurate 40 yard passes every once in a while). No one can seriously say something like that.

 

[Sage]

Deomcracy is for n00bs. I'm taking over the world totalitarian style

You're really underrating fact he constantly leads serie A in all passing statistics from completed passes, percentages completed to distance (aka most passes completed over 20 yards etc. etc.).

He's not amazing, but at the same time, when your only above average asset is your passing and brain, and there is no one worth a damn on the other end of the pass. Where is the problem? It's not coincidental when sheva and others left, aged etc. and weren't adequately replaced, his perceived contribution seeemd less.

I see same passes. I don't see huntelaar, seedorf (2010 version) doing same thing on ends of it like sheva or rui costa

all im saying is that his negative qualities outweigh his positive(passing) which as a result IMO makes him an average midfielder(overall)

listen man, when you have pato(for most of the season) borri and dinho and seedorf in attack, I expect Pirlo to do a much better job in creating, I mean sure Milan dont have drogba or torres or messi, but seriously, these players are good enough for you to assist them and create chances, what did pirlo offer this season? 1 goals and 7 assists? thats pretty poor compared to pizzaro who has 16 assists in serie A with a team thats as strong as Milan if not weaker.

Him passing sideways and attempting ridiculous lobs that end up as a goal kick is useless, its either he's not smart enough to execute a simple pass/through pass or the coach's instructions are simply stupid.

 

[Pedro]

lol

such as what? specifically? Huntelaar contributed more than pirlo?

Huntelaar scored more goals !!

 

[Sage]

Yessss and this


See he can't even say C.Zanetti + Poulsen with a straight face, he knows his joking (I assume he is considering Poulsen is unable to do that, and C. Zanetti is average-good player that does accurate 40 yard passes every once in a while). No one can seriously say something like that.

hahahahah

my point was that ANYONE(with decent passing abilities) can do a 30 yard pass and pass sideways.

 

[Redman10]

I agree, that if Pirlo were to be sold that you need 2 players to replace him b/c the dynamic of the team would have to change but at the same time what Pirlo does is not that difficult to find. I said before a true #10 can do what Pirlo do but would require the team to built around him for him to do so.

 

[drucurl]

hahahahah

my point was that ANYONE(with decent passing abilities) can do a 30 yard pass and pass sideways.

Yip Ambro does it when he isn't trying to kill ppl (see the CL '07 pass to Girlydino vs Manure) and to my surprise Brocchi was dishing them last game

Seriously anyone with good enough technique (and no I don't think Brocchi or Ambro are stellar in this regard) could do it.....My point is why WASTE two players out of necessity if you have to play gps when we could simply employ two simple basic "can do everything well" players

Is that not twice as good as sacrificing a TEAM cdm to become Pirlo's personal bodyguard? All these anti-Pirlo posts have nothing to do with anything against Pirlo but simply the FACT that he's a liability. pirlo WAS a world class midfielder (probably ) and he USED to run the whole show in midfield......but now that our attacks are orchestrated by the more effective Ronaldinho...the point now is getting the ball to either him (who will draw the defense to his side and create an opening) or to Pato (similar idea just more direct) QUICKLY and before the opponent's defense regroups.


What happens and I'd like to see MUCH less of is:

that we are still trying to play Ancelotti's central penetration game with a wide player formation and mentality...in that Ron drifts to his magical island on the left and inevitably drags our left back who has to make the overlapping run and Pato does the same with Abate....4 players gone.....this leads to Pirlo with nothing but a defensive wall in front and the only logical thing to do then is to try to lob the ball over the top. Defenders know they will own him in the first 20 yards or so infront of the 18yard box...so they'll either tackle him and win the ball easily ( ) or they'll foul him 10 yards or so in front of the 18 yard box. Since we have shown our complete inability to score on setpieces from this range the opponents will always opt for this gamble since they will be able to regroup defensively

Attacking-wise we are left with two solutions:
1) Get a world class bruiser/rapist of a striker such as: Rooney, Ade, Dzeko, Ba (think CR7 as a cf), Drogba and Fernando Torres. These guys will latch on to the gps lobs and become a danger in the 18-yd box. (At present, Borriello only gets it partly right...part of the time too. Khunt is f**kin useless unless it's played to feet or for a one-time shot. Pato makes the right runs at the right times but this is a low-percentage pass since either the advancing gk or any ogre of a defender would have a better chance of reaching the ball first). Having one of the above type AND class strikers would be akin to finding some use for the broken gps and will orgasmically excite Pirlo groupies into thinking that he serves a purpose on the field . I don't give a shit since his alleged talents will be once again be utilized to Milan's benefit

2) Replace Pirlo and sadly Dorf with a CM who's overall game is good to great and who has good passing ability/accuracy. A main requirement is that the player is good under the pressure of a physical or pacy marker(s). If he can't hole up the ball in the middle of the park we'd be better off with the squad we have at present because it's easy to rush Pirlo off the ball or pressure him into making a shit pass. As Milano has rightly said he becomes targeted as a way of stifling our game. I believe as long as this new guy is good with his posession (to be brutally honest I could just clone Ambro and use them both instead of Pirlo)

A whole lot of vision isn't really a requirement with our present squad...Just pass the ball to:
a.Dinho the earlier the better so he can advance the ball or have an opportunity himself. Dinho and Anto will sort out the left side attack
b.Pato for a direct attack on goal
c.Borrielo or any centrally advancing player for a 1-time shot.

The player must be reasonably efficient in the defence to assist in the battle in the middle of the park and we would have either two cdm's flanking him or one of Pirlo or Dorf if the opponent's tactics allow for central through balls and shots from distance.


Option 1 requires a world cla$$ $triker which if you didn't gue$$ by now require$ a lot of ca$h

Option 2 isn't nearly that expensive and we could use the ca$h we would have spent on a Dzeko or a Torres into reinforcing the defensive positions, thereby improving our game overall

In essence, Pirlo is an expensive burden that we cannot sustain in my opinion. It's nice to have someone with his rare abilities and intelligence but when your roof is leaking you can't afford to think about redecorating your interior

 

[melanman]

Iam not gonna write story books about this issue, but I will say! I only saw a handful of times The Pirlo that everybody loves, appear this season all the rest were not worth mention.........and again, this world cup is make or break for Andrea........if he doesnt show up in this tournament with best players Italy has to off around him.......then his time is surely at hand...........so let the tournament be the judge of Pirlo's ability.

 

[Wet Ones]

I feel sorry for Milano

He's trying so hard to defend his baby.


Just for you Eshgheman: Forza Pirlo

 

[Wild]

See he can't even say C.Zanetti + Poulsen with a straight face

I just lisetd 5+ players who can easily do a better job + more & other 5+ who can have close to the same impact while having more to offer in other aspects.
Its easy to replace him if we want to.
But yeah , focus the spotlight on "No , Pirlo > Hunt , Zanetti & Poulsen"

And will someone do a Xavi sig so Milano can wear it + feel better ?
Thx.

 

[GreatKalu]

Mad you gonna watch the match Italy vs Mex ...?

I dunno ... I'll see. I've got some stuff to do ... been a busy week. If I didn't waste an entire day on this thread , I surely would have watched. We'll see ...

I agree, that if Pirlo were to be sold that you need 2 players to replace him b/c the dynamic of the team would have to change but at the same time what Pirlo does is not that difficult to find. I said before a true #10 can do what Pirlo do but would require the team to built around him for him to do so.

I would also agree with this ... but bringing in a #10 would more or less take up a fourth spot in midfield, than three - which is how we currently lineup. If anything, if we were to bring in a #10, he would come in to replace either one of our (currently) three forwards, or Clarence, who plays like one anyway. Therefore, a #10 coming in doesn't really affect Pirlo as much as at seems.

The fact of the matter is that Pirlo does no longer require a protector, IMO. His defensive game has improved A LOT, and last season, he basically played as a holding midfielder or central midfielder. I thought he did very well, having some exceptional games, and maybe 1-2 bad ones - acceptable. Other than that, he was consistent throughout the season.

In addition, he played well in most of our big games last season - Real Madrid, he was miles ahead of both Alonso and Diarra combined; United, even though he had Park man-marking him, he was probably our best player when he had something to play for ... MERDA, Roma, again he put out solid performances.

So, even though he started his career as a CAM, he's now a complete CM IMO. I don't think you can say Xavi, for example, is better defensively - or Lampard for that matter. I actually think Pirlo's positional awareness in closing spaces and passing channels is better than those two. Only problem is ... and this is his biggest drawback ... is that he doesn't move into advanced position often enough.

Whether he does this out of reaching his (ability) limit or whether it is a tactical plan, I'm really not sure. It doesn't help matters when everyone pushes forward leaving very little cover for whats remaining of the defense ... I mean, Ambro/Flamini/Gattuso even push forward; Clarence pretty much plays as far up as a forward; wingbacks ... awfully imbalanced - something you can't say of both Chelsea and Bartha, or any other top team.

Reason being, they have more dynamic players. If you're still following me, that means players like Malouda don't just stand in one position of the field. If you look at Chelsea, they had Ballack - Lampard - Mikel in midfield, with Mikel HARDLY getting into attacking positions. And while Lampard pushed forward more, Ballack was a little more cautious when leaving the midfield - not to mention Anelka, Malouda, Kalou, etc. being actively involved in buildups, with all three of the constantly moving to create options for players to pass to.

The same can be said of Bartha ... heck even MERDA - albeit their work rate being miles ahead of any other team. I mean, they coped with Zannetti in MF FFS ... shows you how hard their forwards WORK.

So contrary to common belief, Pirlo isn't a problem at Milan. He isn't a priority that should be addressed. He needs a competitor - that I agree - a prospect challenging him + keeping him on his toes; not to mention, being an avid student But sort out the fullbacks, box-to-box CM, maybe a winger/trequartista depending on the formation we want to play, cover for Nesta, GK, etc. first.

Iam not gonna write story books about this issue, but I will say! I only saw a handful of times The Pirlo that everybody loves, appear this season all the rest were not worth mention.........and again, this world cup is make or break for Andrea........if he doesnt show up in this tournament with best players Italy has to off around him.......then his time is surely at hand...........so let the tournament be the judge of Pirlo's ability.

Shows you how much you know about football.

Club football and international football are completely different beasts. Someone could tear shit up at club level yet flop on the international scene and vice versa.

Forza Pirlo

Bookmarked

@ wild: did you really think you'd get away with stealing an extra of these????

 

[Senatore_M84]

I feel sorry for Milano

He's trying so hard to defend his baby.


Just for you Eshgheman: Forza Pirlo

I hope you're not gonna give me a long kiss onthe cheek like my grandma too

 

[melanman]

I dunno ... I'll see. I've got some stuff to do ... been a busy week. If I didn't waste an entire day on this thread , I surely would have watched. We'll see ...

I would also agree with this ... but bringing in a #10 would more or less take up a fourth spot in midfield, than three - which is how we currently lineup. If anything, if we were to bring in a #10, he would come in to replace either one of our (currently) three forwards, or Clarence, who plays like one anyway. Therefore, a #10 coming in doesn't really affect Pirlo as much as at seems.

The fact of the matter is that Pirlo does no longer require a protector, IMO. His defensive game has improved A LOT, and last season, he basically played as a holding midfielder or central midfielder. I thought he did very well, having some exceptional games, and maybe 1-2 bad ones - acceptable. Other than that, he was consistent throughout the season.

In addition, he played well in most of our big games last season - Real Madrid, he was miles ahead of both Alonso and Diarra combined; United, even though he had Park man-marking him, he was probably our best player when he had something to play for ... MERDA, Roma, again he put out solid performances.

So, even though he started his career as a CAM, he's now a complete CM IMO. I don't think you can say Xavi, for example, is better defensively - or Lampard for that matter. I actually think Pirlo's positional awareness in closing spaces and passing channels is better than those two. Only problem is ... and this is his biggest drawback ... is that he doesn't move into advanced position often enough.

Whether he does this out of reaching his (ability) limit or whether it is a tactical plan, I'm really not sure. It doesn't help matters when everyone pushes forward leaving very little cover for whats remaining of the defense ... I mean, Ambro/Flamini/Gattuso even push forward; Clarence pretty much plays as far up as a forward; wingbacks ... awfully imbalanced - something you can't say of both Chelsea and Bartha, or any other top team.

Reason being, they have more dynamic players. If you're still following me, that means players like Malouda don't just stand in one position of the field. If you look at Chelsea, they had Ballack - Lampard - Mikel in midfield, with Mikel HARDLY getting into attacking positions. And while Lampard pushed forward more, Ballack was a little more cautious when leaving the midfield - not to mention Anelka, Malouda, Kalou, etc. being actively involved in buildups, with all three of the constantly moving to create options for players to pass to.

The same can be said of Bartha ... heck even MERDA - albeit their work rate being miles ahead of any other team. I mean, they coped with Zannetti in MF FFS ... shows you how hard their forwards WORK.

So contrary to common belief, Pirlo isn't a problem at Milan. He isn't a priority that should be addressed. He needs a competitor - that I agree - a prospect challenging him + keeping him on his toes; not to mention, being an avid student But sort out the fullbacks, box-to-box CM, maybe a winger/trequartista depending on the formation we want to play, cover for Nesta, GK, etc. first.

Shows you how much you know about football.

Club football and international football are completely different beasts. Someone could tear shit up at club level yet flop on the international scene and vice versa.
Bookmarked

honestly is this best you can do!

Iam trying to give Pirlo the benefit of the doubt, and you take these attempts at my football knowledge your pathetic. I discuss football with Uefa A qualified coach .....what is the extent of your footballing background.....please explain !

All you want to do is come on these forums and write story books about why Pirlo has not been playing even remotely close to worldclass. Based on your comment I think, deep down you don't believe Pirlo will succeed, therefore you make these childish attempts to attack me.......hahaha........You know Pirlo doesnt have it anymore!!!.........you Just come on these forums and defend his mediocrity.......for shock value sake............again if you really knew about football you would know a true class player never loses his attributes, in this case Pirlo's passing , but what they do lose when they are at the end of their career is the speed, endurance, and strength to continue to compete at a world class level so I say again without the interruptions, of Madman let the worldcup be his Judge...........at the twilight of his career Zidane won france a worldcup.........what will Pirlo do in the twilight of his

 

[Wild]

Can we please not mention Pirlo & Zidane in the same sentence ?

 

[Pedro]

Can we please not mention Pirlo & Zidane in the same sentence ?

Woops! (you just did)

 

[melanman]

Can we please not mention Pirlo & Zidane in the same sentence ?

And why is that I think this is fair comparison?

 

[Sonny.Bill.Williams]

Spot the difference

 

[GreatKalu]

Tried but failed to. Seems like an identical copy to me

honestly is this best you can do!

For what? Please clarify ...

Iam trying to give Pirlo the benefit of the doubt, and you take these attempts at my football knowledge your pathetic. I discuss football with Uefa A qualified coach .....what is the extent of your footballing background.....please explain !

So you discuss football with the Uefa A qualified coach, huh? Next time you discuss, ask him whether players can have different performances for their clubs vs countries. And if he indeed is qualified, then I'm sure he'll inform you of a long list of players who fall exactly in this boat.

I don't get what you were all about with the "twilight of his career" and Zidane comparisons. That wasn't at all what I was referring to. What I said, and quite clearly might I add, is that IF player A or B has an impressive world cup, don't take it for granted that he'll shine for his club in the forthcoming season. Or, if player A or B was outstanding for his club this season, it doesn't automatically mean that he will shine at the world cup.

Broke it down for you enough? Now go on and discuss ...

Woops! (you just did)

Wow ... Pedro! You too?

 

[adriancg]

honestly is this best you can do!
I discuss football with Uefa A qualified coach .....what is the extent of your footballing background.....please explain !:

Lol interweb dick size competition. Get in.

 

[drucurl]

honestly is this best you can do!

Iam trying to give Pirlo the benefit of the doubt, and you take these attempts at my football knowledge your pathetic. I discuss football with Uefa A qualified coach .....what is the extent of your footballing background.....please explain !

All you want to do is come on these forums and write story books about why Pirlo has not been playing even remotely close to worldclass. Based on your comment I think, deep down you don't believe Pirlo will succeed, therefore you make these childish attempts to attack me.......hahaha........You know Pirlo doesnt have it anymore!!!.........you Just come on these forums and defend his mediocrity.......for shock value sake............again if you really knew about football you would know a true class player never loses his attributes, in this case Pirlo's passing , but what they do lose when they are at the end of their career is the speed, endurance, and strength to continue to compete at a world class level so I say again without the interruptions, of Madman let the worldcup be his Judge...........at the twilight of his career Zidane won france a worldcup.........what will Pirlo do in the twilight of his

Dude leave mad alone. He's a hater of biblical proportions. He'll do his best to drive you insane. He almost did that to me with the Ronaldo discussions. He actually doesn't care about this debate...he just wants to goad you into getting an aneurysm.....which he would find hilarious

Gotta love mad n/h

Pirlo is shit. You know it. I know it even madtherchot knows it. Breathe and relax...he'll go one day

 

[GreatKalu]

Dru wants me gone?

Probably have a celebrating party ... huh?

NEVER!!!! Not as long as Pirlo's alive!!!!

... and me too